good place to buy boroscopes

[Shiny]

I think im going to get some split shade boroscopes. which site is best to order from?

[staci]

I wouldn't do it!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I fried my eyes with those boroscopes just not too long ago. I tried 2 different kinds. I bought them through sundance, and I was lucky because they took them back :) Then I went through aura lens and got the 286 split 3/5's. My eyes are so much happier now. I just wanted to let ya know before you went through the same experience as me, it sucked!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[PyroChixRock]

boroscopes = bad for eyes

http://www.auralens.net/m2_glassworker.cfm

[Shiny]

yarrrrrr. arent the new boroscopes better or something. or do the new ones suck too? I want split shade but i dont want to pay 325 dollars.

[PyroChixRock]

they are your only pair of eyes after all...

[Shiny]

fine. if youre going to be that way about it...I guess I will have to go with aura lens. I skimmed the debates and only saw rambling argument. It seems like everyone always says aura though so I will trust the community decision.

[PyroChixRock]

hehe...yep, good choice.

I never post much...ok let me rephrase *eyes the 8000+ post count*

I post A LOT but i never say much at a time heh. I will take the time to tell you though, that I am very happy for your eyes that you will groan and spend the money it takes to protect them. Aura's also come with a lifetime warranty and they do a kids get free loaner shades program.

no i am not sponsored or paid by aura lens in any way. i just like my eyes, and yours. :)

[PyroChixRock]

i guess i still didn't say much bahaha. well, i'm not a girl with many words I guess! :D

[schmoinkel]

hey been wanting get a new pair myself but i cant figure our witch ones are rose colored. i don't want welding shades they're just to dark. the best ones ive had are the economy jobs i got 6 years ago. i can only assume they're boroscopes but they dont hurt my eyes at all. i'd still be using them now if the frames didn't break. i thought about getting the lenses put in another frame at an eye doc in a box or somthing,i liked them do much.

so with ones are rose colored?

scott

[ACE]

are you sure about the warranty misha? a couple weeks ago i was working and one of my lenses just popped out and shattered! i wasn't told about any warranties....and i haven't heard from aura since i sent them in....:bummed:

[PyroChixRock]

I've heard about lenses popping out and shattering, though not in awhile, I actually thought they got rid of the frames that did that. I don't know for sure what's covered under the warranty but I imagine that's covered. I mean, you aren't expected to know it's about to happen and carefully aim the lens to land in a safe place when it happens right? I sure hope not. Mike is a sweet guy and he cares about your eyes, so I'm sure he'll set you straight. ;)

Try giving them a call too. A week can go by fast for all of us. :)

[olra420]

heres the two sites if you want to compare

http://www.phillips-safety.com/Glass-Working-Plastic-Frame/Index.htm

http://www.auralens.net/e_gwtechnical.cfm

look at the graphs compare aur 92(on aura) with ACE 202 (on phillips)

boroscopes are rose didymium glass covered with green welding shade. rose didymium is only ment for soft glass i.e. lower flame temp. The new ACE202 glass from phillips is designed for boro and is very comparable with the aur 92 glass. I have a pair of ACE202 and they work great, never tried Aura though. Spec wise very close and phillips are cheaper, Hope this helps.

[kbinkster]

ACE is the raw material used to make both the AUR92 and the Phillips202. It filters soda flare, but does nothing to protect you from IR (infrared radiation), which is what you need protected from when working boro.

[PyroChixRock]

If it's test results you need to see, please take a look at this thread. (http://www.thegldg.com/forum/showthread.php?t=206)

[billygoat]

the aur 92s arent meant for working colored boro though... i bought em when they came out then discovered there not for working color.. or at least thats what was being said a while ago i thought...get the 286s yer wallet might not like it but yer eyes will....i swear.

[Mike_Aurelius]

The new ACE202 glass from phillips is designed for boro and is very comparable with the aur 92 glass.

uh. NO.

ACE/AUR-92 *IS NOT*, repeating this for the umpteenth time, *IS NOT* designed for borosilicate, and never was. :rant:

ACE/AUR-92 does not block the hazardous IR (heat) radiation that you get when working borosilicate glass. Neither does "rose" didymium. That is why specialized IR filters and welding shades are added to the glass - to block the hazardous IR.

Now, as far as the warranty is concerned: we still have a full warranty on all our products. There have been some delays over the past month or so while we wait for batches of either frames or glass to come in for processing. We occasionally see a popped lens, but they've usually been in one of the metal frames where the eyewire screw has loosened up and the eyewire opens. This particular thing is not a warranty issue -- we do not cover loose eyewire screws. That's your responsibility!

One other point on the lens popping issue -- we've had a couple of pair of the glassworker goggle come in with popped lenses, and when we've looked at the lenses themselves have seen that they were edged improperly. We questioned the customer and it turns out the goggles came from Phillips. The goggle uses a proprietary groove in the frame that requires a specialized diamond wheel to edge the lenses. Phillips is using a standard "v" diamond instead of this special diamond. The result is that the lenses do not lock into the frame and can easily pop out if the frame is flexed too much.

[ShttrdSpctrm]

yeah, so the next "tool" for me is glasses. i was wondering if the 3/6 split are too much? i know the 3/5 are good enough, but just a little more, just a little better for the eyes? right now i got a pair of rose dids, superglued frames, with shade 5 flips twisttied and taped to hold in place.:D

[Cosmo]

I think im going to get some split shade boroscopes. which site is best to order from?

I know a guy that sells them. Come to think of it, you know him too...

:D

We carry both Phillips and Aura Lens. Give me a call/e-mail and let me know what you want, and I'll give you a price.

[Din]

Don't worry about the shade 6 being too dark. I'm rocking shade 6 auras currenty and am very pleased with them. You may need to add a little light to your bench, but that's easy.

[Shiny]

Did anybody else notice that the 250 and 286 are the same thing, but the 286 has a split lens? 100 dollar price difference. maybe i read wrong though. Phillips also has a large price jump when it comes to split shades.

Hey Chad. I didnt know you carried glasses. I looked on your site and didnt find any, but if you have them, I couldnt think of a better place to buy them. Ill email you.

[Cosmo]

We have a LOT of stuff we need to add to our site. We've been working 80+ hours a week since before Christmas. One of these days when we have some spare time I'll get our site updated....

[Mike_Aurelius]

Did anybody else notice that the 250 and 286 are the same thing, but the 286 has a split lens? 100 dollar price difference. maybe i read wrong though. Phillips also has a large price jump when it comes to split shades.

Hey Chad. I didnt know you carried glasses. I looked on your site and didnt find any, but if you have them, I couldnt think of a better place to buy them. Ill email you.

Nooooooooo, the 250 and 286 *ARE NOT* the same thing.

The 250 is a single shade full coverage filter.

The 286 is a split shade, multiple shade filter. That's why is is more expensive.

And to answer the next question, the additional expense is to cover the additional hand labor that is involved in cutting the welding filter lens in half and precision grinding the the flat edge so that they mate when placed edge to edge.

[Shiny]

isnt that what I said? The 286 is the 250 with a portion of different tint to allow you to see. If I bought a 250 shade 5 and a 286 3/5 split, the shade 5 part of the 286 would be the same as the 250, you just get the advantage of the lighter shade to see through in the 286.

Im sure the price increase is justified, I didnt mean to imply that it wasnt. Just noting that if you dont really have to have the split shade, you can have the same protection for 100 dollars less.

If I am still missing something please explain. On your site it said theyre both aur 92 with welding shades over them, but the 286 has the portion of a different shade.

[Mike_Aurelius]

Did anybody else notice that the 250 and 286 are the same thing

This is what I was responding to. A full coverage filter and a split shade are not the same thing. It may not be as distinct a difference to you, but it is to us.

[newmexicomagma]

ok everyone i just went through this whole battle a couple weeks ago. i was almost going to buy the new boroscopes and i sat here and thought why does everyone have auralens even though they r more expensive. now u can do all the research and all the questions but the big question is what is everybody using succesfuly and for years i might add on top of that. this is the reason i decided to go with auralens, for me it was the difference between buying from a local co op or buying from wal mart. phillips is justa big corperation that prolly doesnt give 2 plug nickels about everyone while it seems aura is smaller and more "lampworker" friendly. i got my torque 325 split shades last week and am so glad i did. so its up 2 u but i went with what is known.

[Squirrel]

So wait, boroscopes are bad for your eyes? For a couple months I was using just regular sunglasses, and would always end up with sunspots, and my eyes were kinda sore, but then I *upgraded*? to the boroscope sahde 3.0, and I haven't had any problems since. Do you know how to tell if they are bad for your eyes, or are boroscopes period just bad for your eyes? o_O

[KT-Old School Glass]

Due to problems in the past, Generations Glass no longer carries Boroscopes.

Phillips is using a new lens for them that do offer good protection for borosilicate glass but do not filter as much of the sodium flare as Aura Lens glasses.

We made the decision months ago to carry only Aura Lens glasses for borosilicate work.

We feel that protecting your eyes is one of the most important things we can do and offering Aura Lens for borosilicate work is the way to do it.

[Mike_Aurelius]

Wow. Thank you VERY much Kristian!!!

[Shiny]

Kablam

[Kool]

...One other point on the lens popping issue -- we've had a couple of pair of the glassworker goggle come in with popped lenses, and when we've looked at the lenses themselves have seen that they were edged improperly. We questioned the customer and it turns out the goggles came from Phillips. The goggle uses a proprietary groove in the frame that requires a specialized diamond wheel to edge the lenses. Phillips is using a standard "v" diamond instead of this special diamond. The result is that the lenses do not lock into the frame and can easily pop out if the frame is flexed too much.


How about with the Value Plastic Frame you sell....have you seen any problems with that? The reason I ask is that we are having a bitch of a time with my wifes pair. The one lens just keeps popping out and won't stay put. It's frustrating. When we originally got them, she dropped the glasses and one of the lenses popped out and broke. We sent them back to you and paid for a new lens. When we got them back, the lens seemed a bit off in the frame, but we didn't want to send them back again. However, it seems that sending them back may be the only solution, as it just keeps coming out. Any advice for us, Mike?

[Mike_Aurelius]

Get them back to us. That will be covered under warranty. Things like this occasionally happen on lens replacements, the 2nd lens may be sized slightly different from the first. It isn't a huge problem but we've seen it happen from time to time.

[Kool]

Excellent. We'll get them out sometime this week. Thanks.

[ShttrdSpctrm]

yup thats it, aura lens all the way :bangHead:

[blazeoffire]

Mike , Then when i asked you about my lenses poppimg out you said it was not covered ? I have the rec spec split lense from 4 years ago, i bought them off of somebody maybe thats why my warranty was no good? I still have them, i do not use them because the lense popped out and one of the lenses now has a small chip in it, and i lost the nose peice . But more to the point is this covered since they popped out , and i dont have any screw ?? Or am i screwed?

Don't really like the google style ANY WAYS, could the lenses be put in a biker wrap???




uh. NO.

ACE/AUR-92 *IS NOT*, repeating this for the umpteenth time, *IS NOT* designed for borosilicate, and never was. :rant:

ACE/AUR-92 does not block the hazardous IR (heat) radiation that you get when working borosilicate glass. Neither does "rose" didymium. That is why specialized IR filters and welding shades are added to the glass - to block the hazardous IR.

Now, as far as the warranty is concerned: we still have a full warranty on all our products. There have been some delays over the past month or so while we wait for batches of either frames or glass to come in for processing. We occasionally see a popped lens, but they've usually been in one of the metal frames where the eyewire screw has loosened up and the eyewire opens. This particular thing is not a warranty issue -- we do not cover loose eyewire screws. That's your responsibility!

One other point on the lens popping issue -- we've had a couple of pair of the glassworker goggle come in with popped lenses, and when we've looked at the lenses themselves have seen that they were edged improperly. We questioned the customer and it turns out the goggles came from Phillips. The goggle uses a proprietary groove in the frame that requires a specialized diamond wheel to edge the lenses. Phillips is using a standard "v" diamond instead of this special diamond. The result is that the lenses do not lock into the frame and can easily pop out if the frame is flexed too much.

[Mike_Aurelius]

I'm officially confused blaze. I've *NEVER* said that rec-spec goggles that have lens popping issues are not covered under warranty - quite the opposite. It was the problems with that frame that underscored our dedication to our warranty. Any rec-spec "Demon" goggle that has a lens popping problem is covered under our warranty and will be replaced with the most current goggle we have.

If you want to "trade up" to the Biker, we can do it, however, we are currently backordered on that particular frame. We should be caught up by the middle of March, so if you want to send them in for upgrade, do so now, especially if you aren't/can't wear them. There will be an upgrade charge - the no charge warranty covers only a replacement of the same type of frame.



Mike , Then when i asked you about my lenses poppimg out you said it was not covered ? I have the rec spec split lense from 4 years ago, i bought them off of somebody maybe thats why my warranty was no good? I still have them, i do not use them because the lense popped out and one of the lenses now has a small chip in it, and i lost the nose peice . But more to the point is this covered since they popped out , and i dont have any screw ?? Or am i screwed?

Don't really like the google style ANY WAYS, could the lenses be put in a biker wrap???

[mistahead]

so i wont get into the long story, but i ordered a pair of glasses last spring, you had told me to go through a certain distrubutor, anyhow they never came and i havnt really had the extra cash to get some more for a while, anyhow now i want to get some, what kind of frames are people liking??? i have 202's now the goggles. my nose peice is mush now and the frames get quite hot when doing tube pulls etc...what kind of frame is "the bomb" right now???

[Anubis]

I'm runnin with the Microlite frames right now and I fkn dig em......

[Mike_Aurelius]

so i wont get into the long story, but i ordered a pair of glasses last spring, you had told me to go through a certain distrubutor, anyhow they never came and i havnt really had the extra cash to get some more for a while, anyhow now i want to get some, what kind of frames are people liking??? i have 202's now the goggles. my nose peice is mush now and the frames get quite hot when doing tube pulls etc...what kind of frame is "the bomb" right now???

You ordered and paid for them, but they never arrived from the distributor?

Please PM me with the details and I'll make some phone calls. I won't tolerate this from my distributors.

[mistahead]

NOOOOOO, thats is def not what i meant! i had talked to you via PM mike, i had had explained to you my eyes were very blue and sensitive, you had recomended what wasnt what my distubtor regularly carried (shade 6) they carried shade 5 i believe (286's).when there next shipment of auras came in they werent there. when you posted that you were coming out with new models of frames and stuff i just kinda put it on hold until they came out.
and that brings me to now..and i still need new glasses!!! so what kind of frames are the goods?? im not the hugest fan of these goggles but if theres nothing better then theres nothing better??!!??!!
there was never any money givin for glasses not recieved!!

[Mike_Aurelius]

Ok -- your first post confused me, it looked like you had ordered and paid for something....

In any case, the off-road and torque frames (0602 and 0603) are pretty hot right now.

[nodice]

......... (http://www.thegldg.com/forum/showthread.php?p=134259)

[max16o2]

i just got some 3/6 shades like 3 days ago and i was just about to post asking if anyone else thought thay were too dark. Anyone else think so or does your eyes get adjusted pretty quickly because ive only worked with them once.

[Mike_Aurelius]

Give yourself at least a week or so of continuous use. You will be surprised how well you adapt. You may want to increase your task lighting (a halogen spot or something like that makes a world of difference).

[max16o2]

yeah thats what i was thinking because i didnt want to send them back and have to deal with changing the lenses becuase i really like the frames but i have some problems with seeing around my shop, thanks(good customer service, fast shipping)

[blazeoffire]

Thanks Mike!! I must have misunderstood before when i asked. So would I be able to get the lenses that chipped fixed , since the chip is due to the lense popping out? If so then im sending them in to you ASAP! !!! What i would like to end up with eventually is MX-30 Sports Frame split lense . Would i be able to "upgrade" to these frames? Using my current lenses(repaired by you under warranty) It can't cost to much since the warranty covers new frames anyways ,right???? just the difference in the frames i would think... which no that i think of it , don't the goggle scost more than the MX-30's?? Hmm
Man im stoked if this can be done!!!!! Thnaks Mike! even if you just honer the warranty on the frames your a stand up guy in my opinion., thanks!




I'm officially confused blaze. I've *NEVER* said that rec-spec goggles that have lens popping issues are not covered under warranty - quite the opposite. It was the problems with that frame that underscored our dedication to our warranty. Any rec-spec "Demon" goggle that has a lens popping problem is covered under our warranty and will be replaced with the most current goggle we have.

If you want to "trade up" to the Biker, we can do it, however, we are currently backordered on that particular frame. We should be caught up by the middle of March, so if you want to send them in for upgrade, do so now, especially if you aren't/can't wear them. There will be an upgrade charge - the no charge warranty covers only a replacement of the same type of frame.

[Mike_Aurelius]

As part of the warranty, you will get new lenses, so the chip is a moot point LOL....if you want to upgrade to the MX-30, we've got those in stock, the price difference is $20.00, so it will cost $20 plus shipping for the warranty/upgrade.

[blazeoffire]

As part of the warranty, you will get new lenses, so the chip is a moot point LOL....if you want to upgrade to the MX-30, we've got those in stock, the price difference is $20.00, so it will cost $20 plus shipping for the warranty/upgrade.

PM Me the Address, im on my way home to get them , i will send a money order for $20 along with them! IM SO F-ING HAPPY RIGHT NOW!!!!!:D :D :D :D How long will this take , after you get them??????? Aprox?

[PortlandGlassBlowers]

Hey Mike, Whats the darkest shade you can go?

[Mike_Aurelius]

Hey Mike, Whats the darkest shade you can go?

For stock specs, shade 6 is the darkest.

For custom, non-returnable special order, we can make shade 8 and shade 10. Allow an extra week for those.

[ACE]

i just got some 3/6 shades like 3 days ago and i was just about to post asking if anyone else thought thay were too dark. Anyone else think so or does your eyes get adjusted pretty quickly because ive only worked with them once.

yeah those are the same ones i have- mikes totally right, just keep using them you'll ajust. I got mine 3 years ago and i can't imagine using anything else. you'll love 'em in no time.

and all these people talking about great customer service? well, **ahem**

they couldn't be more right!!:D thanks for being awesome! I got mine back last friday, good as new!

[blazeoffire]

PM Me the Address, im on my way home to get them , i will send a money order for $20 along with them! IM SO F-ING HAPPY RIGHT NOW!!!!!:D :D :D :D How long will this take , after you get them??????? Aprox?

AURA ROCKS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! THANKS MIKE AND CREW !!!!!!!!!!!!

I just got my (replacement) glasses monday and could not be happier !!!!!!!!! Im very honered to be a customer of Aura Lens!!! They have done right by me tenfold.
SO props goes out to them and go buy there product for superior protection and superior customerservice/warranty!!!!!!!
:D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D

[Greymatter Glass]

I'm doing some research on the marketing vs. effectiveness of the two major suppliers of boro workers glasses: Phillips and Aura.

i'm not done, but from where I am at nwo I feel comfortable saying Aura lens beats Phillips.

Both of their high end / flagship lines provide techncially adequate protection from UV and IR - if you're wearing the good boroscopes or Aura lenses made for boro work - under normal working conidtions - you're probably not going to go blind as a result of IR. I am not a doctor, so don't take my words as medical advice.

the boroscopes don't attenuate as much IR as the Aura's do, but the amount they do filter should be enough to protect your eyes under most conditions. if you tend to spend more than 8 hours a day on the torch, or work VERY large pieces, or lots of cobalt based colors you might risk some IR damage, but by no means could it be compared to "staring at the sun" as has been suggested in the past.


Now, eye strain is another matter.

the Aura lenses are optically MUCH higher quality with precise optical centers and very little distortion around the edges of the lens. they also, in my opinion based on observation, block more sodium flare.

Both these factor into eye strain. the boroscopes distort your view, the Aura's dont. the distortion maynot be readily apparent to you, especially with nothing else to compare to, but your eye muscles and brain know something is wrong and will strain to correct minor aberations in the lens leading to eye strain which can be damaging long term.

Sodium flare forces your eyes to constrict making darker areas of your bench harder to see, leading to eye strain when you look up from your glass. the color and instensity of light from the sodium flare doesn't really pose much danger. It is the same spectrum of light you get from those orangeish steet lights or a HPS light.



Another thing.... most peopel have pain receptors in their eyes that prevents us from over exsposure to intense visible and UV light. IR doesn't trigger these nerves right away, but since the source of IR is a broad spectrum source there's also high levels of visible light. If you feel your eyes getting strained from the brightness you're probably also getting IR damage. Brightness is controlled with the use of welder shades or green didyium. if your work feels too bright, but you have the good auras or the mediocre boroscopes then you probably need a higher shade.

people with blue or light colored eyes tend to be more sensative as well - so what works for one may not be enough for another.


....

so, boroscopes get like a C and auras get an a+ on optics and physics. a C is a passing grade, but it's not desireable.


then we get to the mechanics and marketing.

Aura used frames that hands down beat the pants off boroscopes.
They have a MUCH better selection of frame options
Aura offers custom work and quality Rx lenses.
Aura has the best warrenty
Aura has a great program to hook up kids with glasses and exchange them as they outgrow one pair for another.
You can call and talk to the guy who makes your lenses at Aura. I hear he trades lenses for phone sex - but don't quote me on that.
Aura has supported lampworking through thick and thin. phillips is trying to exploit a market they see as viable.



So anyways that's where I am at right now. I think for the extra coin the Aura lenses are the way to go. They last longer, have better support, better optics, etc. The absolute safety isn't as big an issue as some people make it out to be. boroscopes wont make you go blind, but they can cause undo eye strain and are a product that was kinda thrust into the industry to make a buck. they don't give back shit. And I've never seen them at GAS or a flameoff event.


Anyways - no affiliation with Aura lens, but I use their products, and will reccomend them over phillips for the foreseeable future.

for what my 2¢ is worth.

-Doug

[mer]

doug-
if you save the text of that post you should be able to use it here about fifty times over the course of the next year. great info, thanks

[WORLD FAMOUS]

Yet another Boroscopes thread gets hijacked with an Aura Lens ad...hrmmm.

[WORLD FAMOUS]

Hrmmm...


Both of their high end / flagship lines provide techncially adequate protection from UV and IR - if you're wearing the good boroscopes or Aura lenses made for boro work - under normal working conidtions - you're probably not going to go blind as a result of IR. I am not a doctor, so don't take my words as medical advice. -Doug

^^^This is real progress right here folks!^^^


Now, eye strain is another matter.

the Aura lenses are optically MUCH higher quality with precise optical centers and very little distortion around the edges of the lens. they also, in my opinion based on observation, block more sodium flare.

Both these factor into eye strain. the boroscopes distort your view, the Aura's dont. the distortion maynot be readily apparent to you, especially with nothing else to compare to, but your eye muscles and brain know something is wrong and will strain to correct minor aberations in the lens leading to eye strain which can be damaging long term.

Sodium flare forces your eyes to constrict making darker areas of your bench harder to see, leading to eye strain when you look up from your glass. the color and instensity of light from the sodium flare doesn't really pose much danger. It is the same spectrum of light you get from those orangeish steet lights or a HPS light. -Doug

Again Doug, this sound pretty washy. How can we prove these last 2 statements to people that want real hard facts to base their arguments?

[WORLD FAMOUS]

Nevermind...this isn't a battle I want to fight over the internet. I'm not against Aura Lens by any means and I support them for many of the reasons Doug listed above in the Mechanics/Marketing section; I use them myself and trust the product.

With that said, upon receiving a pair of Phillips from a friend, I wanted solid research to prove why I shouldn't use them. All I could find is heavily-biased hype and emotionally charged statements with lots of politics, and not much (if any) actual solid evidence to back up the claims some have made about Phillips. This got me thinking that if I were a beginner trying to sort through all this crap, I'd be frustrated as hell. Phillips' name/product has been smeared so bad already; in nearly every single thread regarding Phillips (such as this one), the thread gets hijacked with pro-auralens hype, and it's hard to sort through it all.

I didn't mean to jump on you Dougie... I guess I will have to do this the old fashioned way and see for myself (no pun intended). :Tongue:

[Greymatter Glass]

nate, I'm not offering proof. I'm offering my opinion based on a hell of a lot more research than 99% of the other opinionated posters here have put into this.

I've NEVER dealt with or talked to a factory rep for Phillips, and I doubt I will. That Mike is around here to answer questions about his product says a lot about him and his company - where's the phillips rep here?

Why do phillips threads get jacked? Define jacked. Original poster asked where to get cheap boroscopes - that could be answered with a quick google search or browsing the various glass suppliers websites. There are a lot of people stepping up and saying "rethink your position based on this advise" - on this forum the answer will always be compounded with extra crap, tis the nature of teh interwebs.

When is the last time you saw a question here get a staright answer? :)

A good analog of this would be a car discussion: Where can I get a cheap chevy cobalt? and you get 20 people telling you chevies are crap, get a ford, and a nother 20 asshats telling you to buy a porsche, and a few morons telling you to buy a used Yugo.



now back to good info... that's what I am trying to do.

I am saying that if you already have Boroscopes (the newer variety) then you're not going to go blind using them.

buying Aura however is not PURELY based on hype and marketing - Aura makes a superior product, period.

The SAFTEY issue, re: IR is over hyped - no doubt.

The QUALITY issue is not a matter of hype, however.

As the old adage goes: you get what you pay for.

both products attenuate IR to a realtively "safe" level (safe depends on a lot of factors, like time on the torch, distance from the flame, types of glass, "peaking" over the tops of your glasses, etc)

I've talked to plenty of people who have been blowing glass for 30+ years and they're not blind.

Without more research I cannot consider the amount of age induced vision problems vs. occupational eye damage and how they relate.


Anyways - when I started blowing glass I used a $25 pair of plastic rose didys - when I realized they weren't cutting it and I decided to get a better pair of glasses. The upgrade wasn't cheap, but my eyes thanks me and I didnt really feel too bad about spending the $25 on the first pair of glasses.

Now.... if I bought boroscopes for $200+ and later on decided they didnt cut the mustard, I would have a MUCH harder time justifing the upgrade cost.


As for confusing newbies... if they can't make up their own mind on this then maybe they should consider another hobby....

anyways no harm, no foul nate, always fun to play :)

-Doug

[Mike_Aurelius]

I'm very touched (and of course pleased) to see your comments Doug. I know we've had our differences of opinion in the past, but I'm glad to see what you've written.

I won't comment on the IR issue -- as you say there's a lot of hype out there and there's been plenty on this thread alone. Enough of that for awhile.

I would like to comment on the quality issue though, because it is important to us.

My father, who started the company (with me) back in 1975, used to work in the precision optics industry. His first job out of high school was at a small company in Chicago called Bell & Howell. Not only did they make camera lenses and projector lenses, but they had several significant government contracts -- mainly with the aerospace industry and NASA in particular. My father is a precision lens craftsman of the old school, when lens polishing was done with pitch and rouge.

Over the years he worked at a variety of optical companies across the US and to each brought the dedication to a quality product that has always been his driving force.

When we started Aura, it was to provide to the ophthalmic industry a product that exceeded the then current questionable quality standards. We produced a product line of lenses that were consistent in curvature and surface quality. Over the next 20 years, Aura was known in the ophthalmic industry as THE place to go to if you needed something off the wall, something that no one else would bother to carry, or was too expensive for the production-line manufacturers to make.

We developed our own lamination process, with tight "optical quality" tolerances, which means that the curves of the matching lens surfaces are far closer than standard ophthalmic tolerances. Which means there is less chance of a delamination from normal processing techniques, much less normal usage and wear and tear.

We don't have 10 people inspecting our lenses. We have one. My father. He inspects every single lens that goes through our factory. We don't have 10 people doing lamination of our AGW filters. We have one. My father.

We pride ourselves on the quality of our products. Our optical quality EXCEEDS the optical standards for the ophthalmic industry. Why? Because it is no more difficult to make an excellent lens than it is to make a lens that only meets the standard.

Doug mentions the point about our optical centers and edge distortion. He's dead on the money. Optical centers that are not in the mechanical center of the lens lead to eye strain. Distortion in the lens, caused by poor grinding and polishing techniques, leads to eye strain. We do not believe that either of those conditions are acceptable in a finished lens that someone is going to be wearing for as long as 12 hours a day, multiple days per week.

(and no, I won't trade lenses for phone sex...........)

We believe in being visible in the industry. I try to be available on the boards to answer questions and discuss the product. Most of you know that I don't take crap and have a very low tolerance for bullshit, and I've gotten plenty of it over the years, because I'm a vendor, one of the few that has the guts to put themselves out on the 'net.

We do give back to the community as well. As Doug mentioned, our Kids eyewear program. We donate glasses to organizations, both as door prizes and to schools who can't afford to give their students proper protective eyewear.

I've long been an advocate of a level playing field and encouraged my esteemed competitor to take part in on-line discussions. But it has never happened, and I seriously doubt it ever will. Take that for what it's worth.