23 people killed on Virgina Tech campus

[Udai Hussien]

from CNN:

Police: At least 22 killed

At least 22 people were killed in two incidents when a lone gunman opened fire on the Virginia Tech campus in Blacksburg on Monday, police said. Police said they believed the shooter also was dead. Tech President Charles Steger called the shootings "a tragedy of monumental proportions."

I am so going to start wearing my class three vest on campus now.

[ech]

Crazy. I lived in Roanoke for 2 years, so I've been on that campus many times. This is why I don't like leaving the house un-armed.

[Udai Hussien]

Yeah I have quite a few friends who are UVT students. good luck trying to ge a call through right now

[Cosmo]

Yeah. I'm in Roanoke right now. I have a friend who is a fellow glass blower who is a student at VT. He's a member on here. I tried calling him, but all the cell phone lines in the area are busy. I sent him a PM through here. I hope to hear from him soon.

I also have another friend who is a freshman up there. I tried calling her, but couldn't get through to her either.

One of my best friends lives about a block from campus. His wife just had a baby about three weeks ago. He was the first person I thought about when I heard about all this. Luckily I have talked to them and they are fine.

I'm on a local car message board and a lot of the members there are VT students. If you want to check in on what they are saying, you can at: http://www.vadriven.com/forums/showthread.php?t=184031

[Udai Hussien]

I'm going to wait an hour or two, then if i still can't get through, I am just going to drive up there, it's only 2 hours up 95

[Cosmo]

You can't get in there. At least you couldn't a little while ago. A friend of mine called me (the one whose wife just had a baby) and they wouldn't even let him off the exit to his house which is over a mile from campus.

Now that the shooter isn't on the loose any more things may be different though.

[ech]

Too bad he killed himself they would've had fun with him up in Sussex.

[Cosmo]

Still no word from the fellow glassblower. Will post when I find out.

[PyroChixRock]

I hope you hear good news, Chad.

[Cosmo]

Me too. This happened in an engineering class. I can't remember if he was an engineering student or not.

As soon as I find out anything I'll let you know. He'll probably post on here when he gets a chance as well.

[susheke]

This is so tragic. I really don't understand what makes such a thing happen. I hope all is well for your friend Chad.

[PyroChixRock]

up to 31 now. :(

[Cosmo]

32 now.

And this is from another message board I visit:


Ok, From a source inside Va Tech, I have heard that they are two unrealated events. The first was a disgruntled boyfriend that shot his Girlfriend and RA in West Ambler Johnston Hall. This person was apprehended on the Drill Field and is in custody.

The second was the shooter that was in killed himself and 30+ about 30 minutes to an hour after the first shooting.

[Kool]

I've got 2 cousins that go to VA Tech. My little brother talked to one of them. One was in lockdown in class until about 1pm EST, he's OK, and the other never went to class and saw the email telling him to stay home. Crazy ass shit, especially if it was 2 seperate incidents...I can't even fathom that they would be unrelated.

[ACE]

I've got 2 cousins that go to VA Tech. My little brother talked to one of them. One was in lockdown in class until about 1pm EST, he's OK, and the other never went to class and saw the email telling him to stay home. Crazy ass shit, especially if it was 2 seperate incidents...I can't even fathom that they would be unrelated.

not totally unrelated, it was the same guy. this guy shot his girlfriend in the dorm this morning and then they thought they had caught the killer, but it wasn't the right guy. and 3 hours later he went and shot the other people.

all of my friends are ok, thank god. my friends brother was shot in the arm but it was a minor injury. i'm pretty suprised honestly, tech is where all the good kids go, the bad seeds usually end up at vcu w/ me...

[Meerkat]

I dont know who this guy is, but some scum is already using the shootings to further his political agenda

http://kotaku.com/gaming/virginia-tech/breaking-idiot-blames-va-shooting-on-games-252702.php

[ShttrdSpctrm]

drugs, prolly prescription for psych. thats why this kind of crazy shit happens. sad :bummed:

[Braden Hammond]

Maybe this thread should be moved or something. Seems everywhere I go I see and here about this horrible tragedy!.Maybe this thread should be moved somewhere else since I don't really come here to catch this type of vibe or news. I know it affects us all but nowadays it's right in my face all the time and it's maybe a bit much.

[Udai Hussien]

Maybe this thread should be moved or something. Seems everywhere I go I see and here about this horrible tragedy!.Maybe this thread should be moved somewhere else since I don't really come here to catch this type of vibe or news. I know it affects us all but nowadays it's right in my face all the time and it's maybe a bit much.

I posted it here, 5 minutes after it was reported, because I have friends in UVT, and I know there are others here, in the area, that have loved ones there. I'm sorry I fucked up your "vibe", but personally, your "vibe" (sic) means dick to me.

Anyway getting past the karma (retard) police, I lost a good acquaintance. My closer friends are safe. everyone please keep these peoples in your thoughts.

[Udai Hussien]

drugs, prolly prescription for psych. thats why this kind of crazy shit happens. sad :bummed:

Yeah man, that really sucks, psychiatric drugs, when used right, work wonders. Change people in wonderful directions, giving them a new lease on life. Unfortunately, when they don't work right, tragedies like this occur.

damn, i am a bit distraught today (after previewing and editing this)

[susheke]

I posted it here, 5 minutes after it was reported, because I have friends in UVT, and I know there are others here, in the area, that have loved ones there. I'm sorry I fucked up your "vibe", but personally, your "vibe" (sic) means dick to me.

Anyway getting past the karma (retard) police, I lost a good acquaintance. My closer friends are safe. everyone please keep these peoples in your thoughts.

Dwaine, I'm so sorry you lost a good friend. You are just one of so many that will be affected by this tragedy for the rest of your life. My thoughts are with you.

[Udai Hussien]

Dwaine, I'm so sorry you lost a good friend. You are just one of so many that will be affected by this tragedy for the rest of your life. My thoughts are with you.

thank you for your kind words.

[β]

Dwaine, sorry to hear about the loss.

[PyroChixRock]

Dwaine, i'm very sorry to hear about your loss. *hugs*

This thread may not be about glass but it does in fact belong in the main forum, because there are glassblowers who attend that school, and friends of glassblowers. This may not be what you came to read, it is your choice to simply skip over it.

[Udai Hussien]

This wasn't a homey, I have parted with him a few times, he is an acquaintance. It still sucks he was killed for no apparent reason, and so were 31 other people. Thank you all for the kind words.

[UmaJulz]

Dwaine, man, I am so sorry.

[mer]

i feel for all of you va/nc kids. that hits pretty close to home. i went to prep school in va and it was pretty chill for the most part. communities are close down there and what effects one usually affects all. much love coming from out west.

[Cosmo]

Just heard from Shiny (the glassblower friend who posts on here). Turns out he wasn't even on campus when it happened. Thankful to hear that...

[Meerkat]

Thought I would share some news articles that are not specifically about the shooting itself, but how people (without any humanity) are capitalizing on the shootings.

This is of course the most disgusting thing ever, the west boro church (Fred Phelps of "God hates fags") will be preaching on the campus saying the people who were shot deserved to be, WTF is wrong with this guy and his inbred family

Here is the main link
http://www.godhatesamerica.com

Here is the google cache (http://72.14.253.104/search?hs=sUq&hl=en&lr=&c2coff=1&q=cache%3Ahttp%3A%2F%2Fwww.godhatesamerica.com%2F+&btnG=Search) in case the link gets bogged down

The cult of scientology is saying its the fault of psychologists perscribing drugs instead of vitamins
Click here (http://www.hollywoodinterrupted.com/archives/sick_celebrity_cult_of_scientology_attempts_to_cap italize_on_virginia_tech_tragedy.phtml) for story

And lastly not a doctor Dr.Phil says that video games are to blame
click here (http://www.gamestooge.com/2007/04/16/dr-phil-suggests-video-games-to-blame-for-virginia-tech-shootings/) for story

[susheke]

People do look for a reason, it makes them feel better. But things like this have happened for centuries. I'm not sure we will ever know this guys reason.

[Udai Hussien]

Fred phelps, and his inbred family are going to get dusted one day. mark my words.

[susheke]

Got to say I agree with that Dwaine.

[mer]

in a rambling note found in the killers dorm room he blamed his actions on his hatred of wealthy students and their party lifestyle. apparently he had a history of stalking people and lighting fires in his dorm room. i have no idea why he was even still on campus.

[susheke]

That is a pretty good warning sign something isn't right with the boy. Wonder why he was still there?

[Kool]

He was an Eng. Lit. major and evidently wrote some shit for a Creative Writing class that was disturbing enough that he was forwarded to the "school psych" or whatever they call it there. So, similar to some previous incidents of psychopathic behavior in our society, there were signs that there was something wrong with the individual.

Someone made a comment about drugs earlier, and Dwaine made a comment that I agree with, to the affect that if used correctly, rx drugs can be good. Some people need prescription drugs, or things can get out of hand. Then again, sometimes rx drugs "make" people loopy too, I just wanted to point out that it can go both ways. You can't blame all abhorrent behavior on rx drugs, sometimes they are what is needed to avoid that type of behavior.

[Meerkat]

Fred phelps, and his inbred family are going to get dusted one day. mark my words.

I am continually surprised that he is still alive, you would think that with all the people he has pissed off in the armed forces, espeically marines, by picketing their funerals, that one of these guys (who are skilled in killing) have not snapped and done so yet.

[jiminyrootkit]

Fred phelps, and his inbred family are going to get dusted one day. mark my words.
i was going to suggest that.... seriously, how many times can you protest a funeral before you cross the wrong dead guy's brother who has an automatic weapon?

my sister and a couple friends actually attended one of wbc's services for one of their (sociology?) classes...... more self control than i have, that.....i'dve jumped over the pulpit and choked that inbred fucktard.

sorry about your aquaintance D. *shakes head* such a shitty fuckin deal....why do people have to be so fucked up?
-f

[Meerkat]

Since glass blowers were among the victims, maybe some sort of memorial collaberation in glass could be done and either given to the school.

[Mr. Wonka]

Quotes:

“In a rambling note found in the killer’s dorm room he blamed his actions on his hatred of wealthy students and their party lifestyle. Apparently he had a history of stalking people and lighting fires in his dorm room. I have no idea why he was even still on campus”.

“That is a pretty good warning sign something isn't right with the boy. Wonder why he was still there”?

__________________________________________________ ____________


Why? Because there’s no such thing as preemptive incarceration in America. I know several people that I am sure will do something similar to this (if not worse), but nothing can be done until they actually do it.

How about a guy that has the same views as Ted Kazinski (Unibomber), Charles Manson, and condones Timothy McVeigh for blowing up the Federal building in Oklahoma because “he did what he needed to do”?

I have not heard direct threats, but all of the warning signs are blatantly obvious.

When something big happens, I will only be able to shake my head and ask why it had to come to this when I (and so many others) saw it coming.

That’s the double edged sword of a free society.

[susheke]

Having had first hand experience with a stalker I do understand how difficult it is to make them go away. One would like to think the school officials would take measure to help a student with such a history. Maybe they were. My question was more indignation than literal.
I suppose we will get more information in bits and pieces over the next few weeks.

[smutboy420]

Because there’s no such thing as preemptive incarceration in America


Thats not realy So. In most states there are metal health laws That say if someone is going to posibly hurt them selves or others. You can call the cops and file a mental health report on them. and the police have to take them in, and have them involintarly commited. (tho its usealy only for 72 hours. inless the shrink says nope hes coo coo hes got to stay)
no if's ands or butts about it. The police are not even allowed to make there own conclusions and let the person go if they "seeM ok" to the police. The law says they are not allowed to make that determination and only a shrink can decide some one is ok or not.

I had an ass hole brother in law that had a stick up his ass with me and meghan. Use that one once to try and pull a fast one on meghan and I.

The mother fucker just has to pick up the phone and he told the cops that meghan and I said we where depressed and where going to kill our selves.
Tho the fact that I had not talked to the guy for at least 6 months befor that. and when he called on us meghan and I were not even in the state. We where on phish tour and we got home at exactly 7 am happy as could be with a strong box full of $ in the truck from our selling endevers.

Well any way about 15 minets later the freaking cops litterly kicked my door off my hinges. With guns drawn and threw me to the floor and arrested me.
They took me to the metal ward of the hospital. Wehre I had to talk to some one and assure them I wasa complealty ok up stairs. After they talked to meghan, meghans mom and my dad, they determined I was ok and let me go. after they all said it was bendictive bull shit. and that I was not even around the day befor to of been able to off expressed any thing to my ass hole breother in law. So ok cool I'm out only a hour of 2 of my time was waisted.


NOPE. instead asshole finds out it din't work So he just called anouther police agency. and next thing I know at 11 o clock. here we go again tho this time the cops dint have to kick the door down because I had't even finished fixing the door yet.

But this time the cops even said they know its a bunch of BS and they knew he had called the day befor on me to. But they police said it was out of there hands and I had to go againbecauise he called again. So I'm like ok here goes anouther hour or 2 of my time. NOPE wrong again J.

Buy the time they go me to the hosptial the shrink left for the day and it was the begining. Of the long 4th of july weekend and the rules say no one leaves with out clearance from the shrink. It took & days for there was shrink on staff to decide it was a bunch of BS and let me go again.
for me to only spend the rest of that day down stairs in the ER with meghan after the stress of all this caused her to have a miscarage.

I spent 2 weeks being on the phone every day trying to find a lawer So I could sue the shirt off that ass hole for viditively making 2 faulse reports on us. Evey were I went they said there was no recourse. Because they don't want any one to not call up on some one or woory they could get in trouble.

You would think if its that easy to get some one locked up just as a prank (and not a very freaking funny one at that.) You would think it would be just that much easier if some one really is nuts.

I think the school and the professer are compleatly libial for this out come. The second they said oh ya we knew he was nuts and din't do a dam thing about it. And they admited on camra that They thought he was going to hurt someone some day.

[susheke]

Being the victim of someone else's problems sucks. Sorry you had to go through that.

[Cosmo]

Since glass blowers were among the victims, maybe some sort of memorial collaberation in glass could be done and either given to the school.

Some friends of mine here in the area are planning something like that. We haven't decided if we are going to give it to the school, or auction it on Ebay and donate the money to the memorial fund they set up.

http://www.vt.edu/tragedy/memorial_fund.php

[Greymatter Glass]

smut.... dude.... i think you played your cards wrong.

Baker acting someone is an involved process - I don't think someone could just call up the cops and say so-and-so is crazy. I know it varies from state to state, but around here the cops have to witness something before they can act, no matter what the reason.

Like Tom said, there is no preemptive incarceration in the US, it's against constitutional law, States CANNOT violate the constitution. Not legally anyways.

the baker act law here only applies to domestic partners, parents, immediate family, psychiatrists, etc. An anonymous call from someone across town who doesn't meet the cops when they come would be dismissed as a false report and he would have been picked up.

Even then you can file your own false report charges against him without a lawyer.

If you couldn't find a lawyer to take your case then there's something you're still not telling us that's vital to the case, because there's no way they would put you through that twice without recourse unless the guy had some bulletproof defense or you actually did something to warrant getting bakered.

thats my 2¢ on that.

on the VT thing... the guy had already been caught lighting fires and charged with stalking. At UNM he'd have been expelled - I put this on VT to an extent for allowing him to remain on campus after he was deemed a problem.

but as for the writing.... words are just words, and they don't always lead to action. I have said some really messed up things in the past just to get a rise out of someone. I appreciate "shock art". words are not grounds for incarceration.

If I were to write an essay here about killing children, blowing up buildings, shooting up a crowd of people, and what not... as long as I don't get into specific planning details (conspiracy) then I am expressing myself under 1st amendment rights.

There ARE limits, you can't make personal threats, or even generalized statements about harming government officials, and you can't slander or libel someone in your writing and expect to get away with it... but those are pretty heafty margins.

So his "plays" aside, the fires and stalking SHOULD matter. What he wrote are just the ramblings of a mad man - but aren't proof of a criminal intent.

-Doug

[smutboy420]

well the brother in lame thing. HE kind of knew the inside loop holes because he works in "the system" But he pulled a lil sneeky one by the whole inishial call being the night befor. But there is a lil tiny loop hole for "emergencies" during weekends holidays or after hours for the famely court. IE if you call during off hours then there is no court the decide and the police act on the call with out the famley court. But un benounced to us they came to the house that night and we wern't there. (well du we had been in NJ for the last few day's.) But dude was stalking the house out or some thing and was right there out side when the cops kicked the door in. So he was like there back come get em. and it was still 7 am. Before the courts open. And the later part in the day every thing was closed.
He punked Meg and I hard. I couln't even get to pissed or any thing or else they would of been like YOUR BEING HOSTAL!!!! :-( :-( or some thing. And would of keep me there.

Dude got his self arrested and lost his job over some stuff he was doing were he was robing mentaly disabled clients and when they died he was chashing checks then the bean counters went in and seen he had all kinds of shady things going on with his $ and bank acounts. And he was enbesiling 100'sk of $ from the state. Here is a news link to that lol lol (http://www.oag.state.ny.us/press/2006/mar/mar14d_06.html) <--now thats a scumbag


I know most places it ain't that easy to just do it to screw some one over. But in a lot of places if some one is realy a freak there are some kinds of things that they can use to hold the person longer if they want.

But they freaky thing is they don't look at being mentaly ill or not as being a criminal or a crime. So the same laws and rights that you would think are aforded to you like if your arrested and charged with a crime. There. FOR YOUR OWN SAFTY. and stuff like that. They don't have court they have "Hearings" and stuff like that if they want to hold someone longer then the 72 hours.

I would just think that if they had stuff like that there and if this guy is as pissed all the time like they say it would seem he would not of passed the tests and they would of at least known they had some one to keep an eye one.

But It just sucks when they all say AFTER some thing happens. "Oh ya we knew he would do some thing like this" Instead of wow he seemed like such a nice boy or some thing like that.

Tho I don't think we can second guess it now thats its happened. But If there going to. They should look a lil bit at the teachers that thought he was a freak.

[Shiny]

so that was weird. I woke up and heard two people had been shot. Then a bunch more. My friend was delivering pizza to the agents and police and said they knew it was over 30 hours before they were saying so on the news.

Dude just lined em up and shot em down when they didnt tell him where his gf was.

The first person I talked to was on his way to the hospital because his friend was shot in the back.

My other friend came over later after being at the hospital with a girl whos finger got blown off while holding the door shut so the guy couldnt get back in. He started shooting through the door apparently.

My roomate had an engineering class right there. She was about to go but got turned around by another student heading away from campus on the way.

Thank god none of my good friends were killed, but we cant even really know until classes start again. All the 200 hippies I live with in this fetid commune are alive which is great, but I have a feeling ill find out alot more when class starts again on monday.

I feel like kind of a jackass about all this. I was sleeping in my bed. Nothing happened to me and nothing happened to my close friends. I was sitting around my living room rolling *cigarettes* in my day old boxers scratching my belly button hearing news about this and that persons friends dying or being shot or jumping out of a top floor window.

I have yet to be on campus since it happened. It just all seems a bit unreal. Especially the entire world news being crammed with their satellite van things all over the place.

The president and the press conferences were all really weird too. If I heard about it hapenning somewhere else, of course I would expect it to be on the news and everyone to want to know what happened, but while it was happening here it just seemed really wrong that everything was on tv before it was even over. It was all too quick or something. Like a presidential knee jerk reaction rather than whatever bla bla bla

The worst thing is all the kids like me talking to people thinking theyre cool because they have the inside scoop and they were there for the action or whatever. Worse than that are the kids who stand in front of people to talk who suffered nothing from this and who feel all kinds of puffed up and moral because theyre thanking people for their support of Va Tech like they actually lost something.

Fuckadoodledoo

[PyroChixRock]

I'm glad you're ok shiny, and sorry you have to deal with all this fuckadoodledoo. I hope your world calms down and returns to a more normal state quickly.

smutty...your brother is an ass! i'm sorry hun. *shaking head*

[ShttrdSpctrm]

smut- sorry to hear that shit happened to you two. that brother in law of yours is a real piece of shit . thats fucked up.

[mer]

I feel like kind of a jackass about all this. I was sleeping in my bed. Nothing happened to me and nothing happened to my close friends. I was sitting around my living room rolling *cigarettes* in my day old boxers scratching my belly button hearing news about this and that persons friends dying or being shot or jumping out of a top floor window.


it's a very normal reaction to the situation that you are in. people often feel a kind of guilt when they are lucky in the face of other's misfortune. it will pass with time. the rest of us are very glad that you are okay. thanks for sharing with all of us.

be well, m

[Cosmo]

it's a very normal reaction to the situation that you are in. people often feel a kind of guilt when they are lucky in the face of other's misfortune. it will pass with time. the rest of us are very glad that you are okay. thanks for sharing with all of us.

be well, m

Yeah. It was weird looking at all the names of the victims and feeling happy that I didn't recognize any of the names. I was happy none of my friends were killed, and sad that others were. Pretty much the textbook definition of "mixed emotions".

[Kool]

...but as for the writing.... words are just words, and they don't always lead to action. I have said some really messed up things in the past just to get a rise out of someone. I appreciate "shock art". words are not grounds for incarceration...

But when coupled with actions, like stalking and lighting fires inside a building, words can be evidence of the need for intervention by mental health professionals.

As folks have alluded to here, there are some failings by the administration of the university and the university police force in this whole scenario. But I think blaming people for not having taking enough action against the shooter before any of this happened is harsh.....maybe harsh is the wrong word, but I guess I'm trying to say even with what we already know about this guy, there may be more we don't know, too. There are so many things that can come in to play in evaluating someone's bahavior and whether or not it warrants action and I suppose that for whatever reason it may have made sense to let him stay enrolled. Hard to imagine, but possible.

That being said, even if I play devil's advocate, I can't even imagine a good reason why it took the university and/or the university police force over 2 1/4 hours to notify people of the first shooting. And why they didn't take more action than just shutting down the building where the first shooting happened. I mean, the guy was still at large, whether you think he fled the area or not, and whether or not you believe he had a specific target (his girlfriend) that had already been victimized, shouldn't people know he's still out there? That's the part where I see major flaws for which there are responsible parties who I believe will have to take responsibility for their actions, or lack of actions. There just doesn't seem to be a feasible explanation.

[mer]

i just heard that the shooter was institutionalized in 2005 for imminent threat to self/others. apparently he lied on the gun ownership application and va doesn't double check. i'm not for additional gun control but maybe we could enforce the controls that are already in effect for just this reason.

[UmaJulz]

There are quite a few more articles on cnn today, explaining a bit more about his dention order, and the warnings of the poetry prof. She did get him removed from the class, and the head of the dept kept teaching him privately.

Shit, there is even more now since earlier this afternoon:
http://www.cnn.com/2007/US/04/18/vtech.shooting/index.html

[ShttrdSpctrm]

[QUOTE=UmaJulz;164716]There are quite a few more articles on cnn today, explaining a bit more about his dention order, and the warnings of the poetry prof. She did get him removed from the class, and the head of the dept kept teaching him privately.

QUOTE]

thats fucked up, the head of the dept ,

[UmaJulz]

the whole thing is fucked up, and more shit just keeps coming up to shake your head at.

[β]

is it me, or does this seem like a first person shooter setup. The way he took the self portraits made him look like he was presenting himself for a video game. It's so sad.

[Shiny]

yea one of my roomates has that professor who pulled him from class. If his writing was crazy enough to illicit that kind of response from a professor, I think it may have gone beyond the shock response argument. I agree totally with that comment, but I cant help thinking all this was too blatant.

I think video game control is more important than gun control at this point.