short tubes

[superstupid]

how do you guys use the ends of your tubes without burning yourself?
particularly larger tubing. ive been using claw grabbers with minimal success. sometimes i pull it off, other times i fumble with it and it ends up cracking from pulling it in and out of the flame. seems to be too heavy most of the time so it just slips out of the grabbers, even pieces onl about 6in long. are there a really good set of grabbers i should look into? or another method? for reference im using mostly pieces 50x2.5 slightly less than a foot long, and some 38x4.

[garrick]

i use claws but is a bitch when you try larger tubing, i would like to hear how others do it also.

[Frankie Hess]

I just heat them a little slower so as to get a perfectly even heat base around the tube with the end of the tube angled at a 45 degree angle down once it is getting molten, then get that bad boy nice and hot and pull it (90% gravity pull) straight up and down with the end of the tube toward the ground. Gravity is your friend, I do this with some regular old grabbers.

While I'm heating, I am doing the turning 90% with my hand that is holding the point, the hand holding the grabbers is just a guide. I barely put any pressure or pull with the grabbers.

Gravity and patience, may the force be with you!

Yes I pull these perfectly straight.

[Rojas]

dont let your self end up with pieces like that. say you have a piece of tubing that is 1 foot long open at both ends. attach a blow tube to both ends and tear it in half. dont end up with pieces that are short and open at both ends. punty up with a piece of 12mm rod to the closed end and hang on to that to attach your blowtube. ive never had much success using claw grabbers on big short pieces of tubing.

[Big Jay]

^^^^^ what Rojas said.

[CripSkillz]

Ya i been having the same problem always jack it up trying with the claw, always to hot to hold,

Thx Rojas

[superstupid]

dont let your self end up with pieces like that. say you have a piece of tubing that is 1 foot long open at both ends. attach a blow tube to both ends and tear it in half. dont end up with pieces that are short and open at both ends. punty up with a piece of 12mm rod to the closed end and hang on to that to attach your blowtube. ive never had much success using claw grabbers on big short pieces of tubing.

ok, ive tried this, but the tube will usually crack at the blowtube.im still slow and on a small torch, so it takes me a couple hours to melt through a foot of tubing. now i know kilning would solve this problem, but i have a pretty small kiln. if there are a few pieces in there(which there will be by time i get that far down the tube) a 6in blank of 50 mil isnt going to fit. i just wish there was an awsome set of grabbers to handle the job(hint to all tool makers if one isnt available already). the few times ive pulled it off were cinch.

[superstupid]

oh yeah, thanks for the replies.

[VED]

i do kinda what rojas said. i start with about a 1 1/2 foot long section and close up one end and attact a blow tube. i then work off of the other end by closing it up and attaching a blow tube to that end and tearing off the section of glass that i need then just repeat and when you get down to the last section it already has a blow tube on it. good luck

[Frankie Hess]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Lmaq-UQdwVI
I pretty much do it the way this dude does, depending on how short the end is determines whether or not I use the grabbers.

But I pull points for most of my prodo, and use blow tubes for some things.

[JANKYglass]

it cracks at the blow tube cuz its not melted in all the way,your leaving stress when you connect then let it cool it will crack then or most def when you get heat near it again.

and if your slow and on a small torch you probably shouldnt be working 50mil tubing.you need proper tools to do bigger jobs.not to say it cant be done but its like you racing cupcake and his lambo in your dodge stratus.sure youll make it to the finish line but.................you get my point.

[superstupid]

and if your slow and on a small torch you probably shouldnt be working 50mil tubing.you need proper tools to do bigger jobs.not to say it cant be done but its like you racing cupcake and his lambo in your dodge stratus.sure youll make it to the finish line but.................you get my point.[/QUOTE]

bigger jobs? i make lighter sized,fairly thick, i/o spoons and bats.takes 30-40 min w/ prep for me on a lynx. its 50x2.5, so its not really that much glass. i could blow out 4in of 26x4, or i could just rip off a piece of 50x2.5 and be ready to decorate right then.(thanks firekist & bigles) it saves too much time and effort for me not to use it. ive done both ways and its much faster for me. anyone who doesnt use large thinner wall tube for these type of things is missing out imo.
flaring is for goblets:D

good lookin out though, janky.sorry for the rant. i know everyones heard it before.

so back to the subject at hand. i know its cracking because of stress but doesnt letting anything cool at such a rate cause stress in its self? i really just wished the claw grabbers would hold. no more games and its quick as hell. maybe if i tried to coat the tips in something with some traction, it would make the grabbers useles for some other applications, but since i dont make anything big i dont use them for anything else right now anyway.

[seadal]

Make a T with some 8mm rod. The top of the T has to be long enough to match the diameter of the tube. Attach the ends of the top part of the T to both edges of the tube and pull a point. Know what I am saying?

[Frankie Hess]

A Lynx isn't that small of torch for 50x2.5 at all. I was wondering if you were running a Lynx when you said small torch. I have made an I/O bubbler out of 50x5 on a Lynx.(took too long but doable) You should have no problem doing what you're doing on a Lynx. Your cracking is most likely just from not getting a good weld, or the glass being too thick where you're welding.

[superstupid]

A Lynx isn't that small of torch for 50x2.5 at all. I was wondering if you were running a Lynx when you said small torch. I have made an I/O bubbler out of 50x5 on a Lynx.(took too long but doable) You should have no problem doing what you're doing on a Lynx. Your cracking is most likely just from not getting a good weld, or the glass being too thick where you're welding.

see having to wory about making a good seal just doesnt seem worth it, when the grabbers are only falling just short of being the absolute most convenient way possible. maybe if there is no other way. honestley, i think i may be waiting for someone to say "hey, i have this 150 dollar grabber...uhhh.."lol

[Big Jay]

A good seal shouldn't take that long. But trust me when I have say I have ruined at least 2 dozen pieces not paying good attention to my seal. Heating the flare on the blow tube and heating the tube itself at the same time to the right point put them together one or two turns in the flame and slightly pull it out and your done.
You shouldn't have to kiln it to keep it from cracking. When mine crack its almost always cause I over heated the seal and let a large mass of glass sink into the tube(not the blow tube) and now I have created an angle inside the tube and once I go back and hit it with the flame crrraaacck.
I do all my cutting and welding with the lynx.

[nicko0]

once your tube gets down to 8 inches or so.... i use a blow hose and a large stopper with a hole in it to stick the blow hose in. so i can blow into that large tube and get an even round end. then i pop a hole. reem the edge of that hole a little to give it a lip. then take a blow tube put a cork in one end. get the hole in the tube and the end of the blow tube near molten and attach. then pull apart a little and blow to achieve an even thickness and even heat throughout the seal. using a blow hose and rollers will greatly help in getting an even heat and thickness and help to keep from putting stress into the seal from bending it while the glass is cooling.

[Swampy]

I dunno if this idea (http://www.thegldg.com/forum/showthread.php?p=329398#post329398) might help, anyway just brainstorming...

[JANKYglass]

and i can make a dub bub on a national but that doesnt make it the proper tool.

[yinzer]

i would say go with the blowtube to each end/cut in half method. you might not want to have to worry about making a good seal. but if you have cracking issues with your seals, you could probably use the practice anyways

[$$$$$$$]

use that shit as a sleeve for something or just do a blow in..

[garrick]

i would say go with the blowtube to each end/cut in half method. you might not want to have to worry about making a good seal. but if you have cracking issues with your seals, you could probably use the practice anyways

yeah, i believe this may be the best method, i have done this before but out of laziness of the moment i dont always take advantage of it. i rarely use anything bigger than 38.10 though and the claws work fine for that, but i do have plenty of 6 to 8 inch pieces of larger tubing that have accumulated over the past 8 to 7 years.

[Breed]

Hers some expensive grabbers. (http://www.winshipdesigns.com/home2/ws3/page_6521_56/universal_holder_45_100mm_2510_b.html)

Might be stronger.

[somberbear]

im actualy not a huge fan of those breed, they are good for grabbing certin shapes ,

These work better (http://www.winshipdesigns.com/home2/ws3/page_6522_56/universal_tube_holder_30_60mm_dia_2512_b.html)

for short tubes but there monsters in weight wise to keep spinning i like em cause i can use them in my lathe with out an issue....

peace
rob

[superstupid]

JANKYglass: and i can make a dub bub on a national but that doesnt make it the proper tool
lol look at you, getting by on a technicality:D all of you big marble makers better scrap your mirages and deltas and get a 3 stage torch. speaking of using proper TOOLS!! thats just what i was looking for




ok, sooooooooo, i need a bigger torch, and need to work on my seals? is that what you guys are telling me? :dieslaugh



now, i can make a proper seal, i just dont want to have to. why should i if there is a tool that allows to do without. seal = 15 seconds, grabber =1 second. i call that a no brainer. a blow tube serves no purpose here except as a handle, why not just have a handle? not to discredit the blowtube people, and i truly appreciate you guys taking the time to reply. i just try to follow the path of least resistance.

rob, you just got man of the year in my book, too bad these things are out of stock, but i need to get some grip together any way. ididnt see a price, but from what you guys were talking in the other thread, its going to be pretty steep. but i think thats exactly what i wanted out of this thread so thanks to rob and every one else who ragged on my seals and my torch.:tongue2: j/k :D

[yinzer]

"ok, sooooooooo, i need a bigger torch, and need to work on my seals? is that what you guys are telling me?"
"now, i can make a proper seal, i just dont want to have to. why should i if there is a tool that allows to do without"
"ok, ive tried this, but the tube will usually crack at the blowtube."

geez dude sorry if you were insulted by my honest answer. you couldnt figure out why it would crack right by the seal earlier in the thread. that says to me maybe you could use the practice anyways. i dunno i just kinda see seals as something relatively important. but then again, i still pull points...

[superstupid]

i was just giving you guys shit, thoght i was clear about it. i dont know? i never said i didnt know why it cracked at the blowtube, thats pretty obvious.like isaid i CAN seal it propely, its actually how im doing it for the moment, i just dont want to. i dont care who you are, if you make seals and dont kiln them there are going to be issues with cracking. kilns wouldnt be such a big deal if there werent. mine dont crack every time but it happens, and when it happens it usually takes the rest of the tube down with it. that sucks . like i said why use a blowtube as a handle when you can use a handle? refer to jankyglass for use of proper tools. by the way, none of you guys can insult me, im an ultimate shit-giver. it goes with the territory.

[mer]

i dont care who you are, if you make seals and dont kiln them there are going to be issues with cracking.

i make blanks (4" of 44x4 or 38x4 welded to a 9.5 or 12 blowtube) by the dozens and leave them standing in my brick w/o using a kiln all the time. i also weld 12 & 9.5 onto my pullbowls and set them aside to batch anneal by the hundreds. if your weld is clean you shouldn't be having to worry about cracking.

[superstupid]

i make blanks (4" of 44x4 or 38x4 welded to a 9.5 or 12 blowtube) by the dozens and leave them standing in my brick w/o using a kiln all the time. i also weld 12 & 9.5 onto my pullbowls and set them aside to batch anneal by the hundreds. if your weld is clean you shouldn't be having to worry about cracking.

fair enough, you just heat both pieces then touch and pull? you dont spend any time working the seal?

^^^i think that kind of makes me sound like a dick , but im really not trying to be


i still think grabbers are the better option for my situation. less work = less time spent = winner all around

[mer]

well, i rarely have to weld a blowhose to an short piece of open large tubing because i do the same thing that others have suggested about welding blowtubes onto to both ends, but when i do have to use a short open piece i put a cork in the end of the large tube. it gives you a little extra length to hold onto and it doesn't get as hot as the glass.

[superstupid]

i was just wondering if when you weld your blowtube to your blank, do you just get both pieces hot and touch them together for an instant weld thats clean enough to hold up, or do you have to work it some to get good? i have 99% of my cracking issues with the 50x2.5 when i just do a quick touch, tug , and go weld. when i go around and work it in, cracking isnt as much . i thought the thinner wall tubing was being finicky because it seems to crack just from getting the tube hot letting it cool and flashing it again .

[Rojas]

ok get a big rubber cork with a hole in it. get a piece of that long threaded metal tube like the kind that goes inside of lamps. get 2 nuts that will thread onto the metal tube and 2 washers that will fit over the metal tube but not wider than the cork. stick the metal tube in the hole in the cork until it sticks out just enough to put on a washer and nut. put the other washer and nut on the other side. now you should have a tool that has a rubber cork on one end with a metal tube running thru it . you can stick this into pieces of tubing that are too short to hold onto bare handed. you can blow thru the tube if you need to. the one that i have made will hold pieces of 50x5 that are 4-5 inches or less. anthing longer and they tend to get crooked and fall off the cork. i barely ever use the one i made.

[Breed]

rob: those do look better, i must have glanced over them because they were out of stock. man if i had an extra $500 sitting around those look useful.

[Kimbell]

all of those suggestions are great although, i personally think the absolute easiest way is to take the tube - aprox. 1 foot long open ended on both ends- hold with hand on outer sides, heat the middle of the tube aprox. 2 or so inches wide really hot then pull, i normally pull it about 3 feet. then all you have to do is cut the point in the middle and open up the ends. when finished you have two aprox. 5 inch chunks of tube with a pulled blowtube on one end, if you do it right it will be long enough so that you can hold it far enough away form the flame as not to burn yourself as well as be counterbalanced enough so it wont seem to heavy on the end your working

[preglassok]

Ok, in no way am i saying this is the right way to do it. but it worked for me when i didn't have claw grabbers, or if the claw grabbers aren't holdin on. I just make a " Y " punty. cold seal it to the tube and then pull a point like that. then just tap the punty off. Here is a very crude picture of what i'm talking about.

[Mark F]

I pull points so I use the T shaped punty on the open end.

[CripSkillz]

Damn I dont know why i never thought of that

Thanks Guys

[Zed]

I've always thought these would be the bomb, as you can blow the tube without the need for a blowtube or a point. But I've never tried them as they are too taxed for my blood. The barbed fitting at the bottom for a blowhose is cool.

If someone has these, (I think in some other thread someone said they did, and only paid $250 for them, at that price I'd probably invest) please tell me how you like them and if they save you time or anything else cool they can do.

http://www.winshipdesigns.com/home2/ws3/page_6509_56/tube_holder_30_60mm_243a.html

[tilman]

i always put on blowtubes before i get to that point but check out the beginning of this video. karl termini uses these grabbers and i think its just what your looking for. he is on this board so you could prolly send him a message and ask him about them. they look like they do the job for him.

peace

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4U-ZI1i5KtU&feature=related

[Rojas]

i actually have some of those grabbers. i never really use them. i will sell them to you if you want.