Whatcha all think of the new GP set-up?

[bc]

I personally don't like it, seems a lil confusing, where's the most recent post etc? Who knows, with time maybe I'll love it. What you think?

[Chubbles]

i dont like it.

[flamebob]

menu is kind of annoying to navigate.

[ACE]

*sticks finger in mouth and makes pukey noise*

[Braden Hammond]

uhh ... not soo much....

[Dom]

Me neither.

[garrick]

i dont like it neither, first with the people paying for the top spots which is cool for justin i guess, but i tend to just skip past all of the highlighted names to find the new stuff which means ive missed alot of new jason lee pieces and others. i have just recently realizied i have been doing this.

now with the latest upgrade the whole thing just seems to be a pain in the ass. i doubt i will be checking it as much anymore unless i am just looking for inspiration.

now bring on the haters for speaking my mind, i know its free and justin has and is doing alot for our community but i got alot of sites that i check on a regular basis and when one tends to be hard to navigate i quit bothering with it. just my 2 cents.

[Ben Burton Glass]

It could just be a temporary problem... maybe he's recoding the site and it's in th mid-stages still...

Aloha!

[bc]

i dont like it neither, first with the people paying for the top spots which is cool for justin i guess, but i tend to just skip past all of the highlighted names to find the new stuff which means ive missed alot of new jason lee pieces and others. i have just recently realizied i have been doing this.

now with the latest upgrade the whole thing just seems to be a pain in the ass. i doubt i will be checking it as much anymore unless i am just looking for inspiration.

now bring on the haters for speaking my mind, i know its free and justin has and is doing alot for our community but i got alot of sites that i check on a regular basis and when one tends to be hard to navigate i quit bothering with it. just my 2 cents.

Na, your not a hater, we all appreciate justins help. If I was making a change to something folks were invovled with an they didn't like it, I'd wanna know. I also agree with the 'sponsered artist', I've been panning right down to the new stuff an forgetting about the top of the page artist. Outta all those peeps, you see the same pipe an just wanna get the to 'new' stuff.

[fashon kore]

its not the best, but it works. just get used to it

[Blacksheep]

dont like it much either ,pics are too small and then they expand if the cursor goes on the pic shit poppin up all over lol

i also scan down right away to the new stuff but is there some new mixed with the old up top as well i think maybe .im basically the same as most disregard the top of the page and get to new pics.

perhaps the smaller pics have to do with storage room ? i dunno . i will get used to it if its here to stay but prefer the old way like 2- 3 improvments ago

[loydb]

Hate it.

Hate the fact that the front page has the same pics on it all the time, and that new stuff isn't automatically on top.

Hate the tree view in galleries.

I don't think *any* usability study was done on it -- they just decided to change it, and thought it would be cool like it is now.

I don't think it is, but maybe they do...

[Lurch]

not a big fan either. Everything is popping up when I move my cursor, I didn't mind the artist sponsor being on top with the colored names. I wish they would post new stuff more so it changes, and I did like scrolling down the center to find the white name artist stuff... it was an easier site to navigate.

[mer]

i was getting frustrated on these sites anyway. i hope justin can find a way to get back to what made the sites popular in the first place. they keep changing and i haven't heard anybody say they like any of the changes yet.

if you're reading this justin and you're looking for constructive criticism, it drives me crazy when i'm moving my cursor to the scroll bar and pics enlarge just because my cursor crossed over the top of them. it's like i have to make my cursor sneak around the long way to get to the scroll bar so i don't have another image pop up and block me from getting to it.

also, i would find it personally embarrassing if i was the one artist on GA who paid for the top level. she has most of the visible real estate but she hasn't posted new work in forever so we keep scanning over her same old stuff to see something new. it seems like she's paying tons of money just to earn the resentment of all the other regulars. i know she has the option of taking them down herself but i get the impression that she paid but she doesn't even log in enough to notice that she's still hogging the whole front page.

anyway, thanks for all you've done for us over the years. i hope you find a way to keep the sites alive.

[Primathon]

I don't know why, but that pinstripe black-and-grey background causes the most horrible flickering on my laptop. Yeah, I know it shouldn't (http://www.dansdata.com/gz021.htm), but it does. Anyway, makes it pretty much completely unusable for me. And jeebus that's a lot of unnecessary JavaScript.

[Jupiter]

Love the site and all its done for me (GA not GP for me)

not happy with the layout at all

id be embarrassed to tell some to go find me there, I used to tell everyone to go there rather than my own website.

mermonkey hit it right on the head about the lady with the same pieces at the top for months. Justin needs to make money for his time but this is ridiculous and will stop people coming to the site.

is there a problem going on right now. none of the new pages show. just the sponsered?

I used to look several times a day, but now i almost never do.

[Micah Evans]

i agree Jup, i rarely go to GA anymore and when I do its only for a second before I say fuck this bullshit. It was bound to turn into a money making business instead of an online community, I was just hoping for better integration.

now I have to strike GP from the list as well, i just want to catch up on whats new. not whats new with people that pay Justin.

oh well, it was good while it lasted

[skip]

I used to look several times a day, but now i almost never do.
Reply With Quote

ditto

[Jake C]

no good....maybe i just dont like change...but it was way cooler a year ago

[justin]

Once again thanks for all the feedback, I had a feeling that there'd be some talk over here after I changed the front page again. The #1 frustration expressed is not even part of this new round of changes, it's still premium users at the top of the new galleries issue. I am working on how to fix that without having all my premium users get mad at me and demand a refund. If nothing else I will segregate them into their own box so you can skip over it and go right to the newest pages. Also I was thinking about making it an option for signed-in users to hide the premium users on the front page. Since the vast majority of people browsing the site are not signed in but just random visitors, the premium users could still get lots of exposure without it having to annoy members of the site. Let me know what you think of this idea.

My goal with this new round of changes was to shrink the height of the front page down as much as possible without reducing the amount of content on it. I do see that the popup boxes can be kind of annoying but on the up side they allow me to put a lot of stuff in a small amount of space and then have it balloon out if the user happens to be interested in a particular picture, without having to actually leave the front page. I think it creates a richer experience, but agree that the level of interactivity might be too much for some users.

The right hand category navigation is also admittedly a bit of a pain in the ass sometimes because it can get all out of control for a second. I tried to tweek the way it animates to prevent this from happening but without much success. Even so, I still think it's an improvement because the entire hierarchy of categories is accessible but it doesnt have to expanded all at once.

Primathon: Are you running at your LCD's native resolution? I've noticed the flickering on LCDs which have been set to a slightly different resolution. By the way I am also hoping to do a graphical redesign once I'm finished with the layout and functionality changes.

Micah: GA/GP have been part of a money making business for years. This is what I do for a living more than full time. I am seriously dedicated to the goal of building online communities that kick ass in every way possible and manage to please everybody while also being self-sustainable. I welcome your suggestions.
Thanks!
-Justin

[Primathon]

Yeah, I'm at the native resolution -- I've never noticed it on any site but yours, to tell the truth. Something about that 2px pinstripe...

One thing that crossed my mind would be to have all the Javascript events act on a delay, so dragging your mouse across the screen wouldn't toggle anything but hovering for a second or so would. I think this would let the page feel responsive without being overly busy.

As for the redesign, I'd say you need to "get outside the box", so to speak. Every time I visit those sites, it just feels like a jumble of boxes... Having columns separated by the module headings would feel much more cohesive as opposed to everything having its own little box. Anyway, just food for thought.

Also, I dig your idea about the premium members. It makes a lot of sense, and I think it'd work well.

[Micah Evans]

hey, keep it up glad its paying off. part of the reason I liked it was the fact it was a small tight group at one time, not so much anymore. Lots of production "studios" on GA instead of "Glass Artists", thats the main reason I don't go there anymore. But that has everything to do with GA gaining popularity and turning into a profitable resource for small artist and large studios, its a good thing.

With most things that are cool, the people who have been there for a while always say it was way cooler before it got big. I am totally one of those people, lol. I don't use it for business anymore but I do use it more so to spot upcoming talent and trends. By giving most of the exposure to people who pay for it takes away some of the magic of stumbling upon new work and emerging artists.

it looks like you are working on some of these issues and i hope you find a way to please your sponsored artists as well as leave an avenue for upcoming new artists to get some exposure and one day pay for a sponsorship as well. looking foreword to seeing what you come up with and would love to see a graphical redesign in the future!

[justin]

Primathon: Very good feedback and I already agree with you about the redesign, it has been a long time coming and what is happening now is part of the process. Once the layout is settled into what I feel is a good compact configuration that works I will start doing the graphical redesign and get rid of those crazy 1 pixel stripes and the gloomy crowded boxy feel. I'm going to try and switch the popup boxes to a click instead of hover so they won't all be jumping out at you. They just need a close button.

Micah: Thanks for replying, it's good to have input from someone who's been around since the beginning. If you feel that the site has lost something good along the way, maybe we can identify what that is and bring it back.

I see a definite need to create a better space for members of the community, and I'm thinking that this should be separate from the front page, whose main purpose should be focused on welcoming new visitors. This is sort of what the Control Panel page was meant for, but it is already getting pretty full with just account-related functions so maybe we should also have a sort of community dashboard page that would greet you on sign-in and would be optimized around bringing you up-to-date with all the newest stuff that had been posted around the site.

[Ben Burton Glass]

I'm a huge fan of the site, But I'm not into the new "New on GlassArtists.org" galleries section. The triple boxes just seem to cluttered to me (and the imidiate pop-ups make it a bitch to look at or scroll through), and I liked the small bit of text that used to be shown, almost like a caption to help give an extra idea of what the gallery holds if you click into it to view all the pics.

I don't think the vertical height was a problem. But the premier users do often get over looked while scrolling down to see what else is new from the non-premier users. The page still has the same vertical length it used too because of the 'featured galleries, past features, Other Online Communities, and Partner Site Features.' All those still provide the need to scroll downwards to check, and it leaves a big empty gap in the middle that seems like wasted space... The old layout that filled this area in with 'New on GlassArtists.org' and the forums seemed more manageable. IMO

GA.org has been my homepage since about as long as I've had a computer and internet access, but like some of the others mentioned, I don't spend as much time looking at or through it because of all the 'clutter.' I tend to get frustrated easily and if that happens, I just do something else or go to another webpage (not necessarily glass related)... HTH

Aloha!

[justin]

I've made some changes in response to your feedback:

* Premium pages are now limited to 1 week of being on top
* New pages popups are now click activated not hover activated
* New pages area now limits each user to 3 pages displayedated
* New pages area height shrunk down to 3 rows, 27 total browseable (3 screens of 3x3)

also more page compacting:
* Featured Pages boxes have been compacted down into moving sliders
* Partner features moved from all pages to front page only

[mer]

definitely way better. thanks justin!

[lava flow]

I liked it the old way, but I'm a DJ that still plays records, so pay no attention to me...

[Dom]

Everything looks good so far, but I would still say change the New on GP to the old layout of horizontal boxes for each new post.

[Ben Burton Glass]

Everything looks good so far, but I would still say change the New on GP to the old layout of horizontal boxes for each new post.

I agree with that... I still think the 3x3 setup is irritating... The Horizontal layout was better even if the page was longer...

Aloha!

[bc]

Everything looks good so far, but I would still say change the New on GP to the old layout of horizontal boxes for each new post.

Agreed again, an I gotta say I don't like the feature being a scroll side to side, I gotta wait to see the pipe I just missed an wait for everyother feature before I can see the one I want to.

Justin, we all appreciate the work an site but,


if it aint broke, don't fix it..... an I mean that in the kindest regards.

[slinger]

my .02 is to simplify it... i feel like its getting worse and harder to navigate with every "upgrade"...

whatever happened to a simple clean aesthetic?

im spending less and less time on those sites, simply cuz it hurts my eyes, its too confusing, and i think all the changes are not inspiring people to post up....

i wish it was more simple blog style, looks like a complete mess as is..

[justin]

I am very hesitant to switch the new pages back from their 3-column layout because I don't want to make the page taller again, and I would like for visitors to be able to see as many new pages as possible in the amount of space given. What are your main concerns about it, is it just that it looks messy?

Personally, I have been liking it, seems like I can review a lot of new pages very quickly and then get a lot more in-depth info from the popup box without leaving the home page. The main thing I feel myself wanting is a button that will load the next page of icons into the window so I can keep reviewing more.

BC: I think I could fix your complaint about the feature sliders by adding a pair of arrow icons so you could move the slider. I've been planning to do that and will at some point.

[mer]

at first i was tripped out that each piece's thumbnail on the front page had the title but not the artist's name. after thinking about it for a minute though i realized that it makes the work stand on it's own instead of relying on the reputation of the artist.

i actually love the idea that good work gets a click even if it's not made by somebody that's already "famous". i bet that some of the people who are just selling their name won't be thrilled though.

[justin]

I could take it even one step further and remove the title, just have tiled thumbnails and let the image stand on its own. It would look really clean and pretty without all those messy words up in the mix. With the popups you can see just about everything about the page, a lot more than could have fit with the old setup that was big AND messy.

Another thing I'm planning to do with those is have thumbnails of images on the page start loading in a row at the bottom of the popup box as you're reading it. So you can get an idea of what else is on the page before you go there.

[justin]

I set up GA with no titles just to see what it would look like. I kinda like it. Also you can now see 4 rows instead of 3 in the same amount of space, or 3 rows in a smaller space. I also made it so you can see the title and artist name by hovering the mouse over the image. Also I removed most of the striped background images from the site, I think that's helping make things look a lot cleaner. Take a look and let me know what you think.

[bc]

Yeah, I like it better without the titles, makes it so if you see a piece you like, you'll click on it rather than, oh it's 'such an such' I'll click on that. I also like the arrow buttons that let you move the features at your speed, think most of us gp'ers would like those changes.

[Ben Burton Glass]

I'm not sure why having to scroll downa little to see the rest of the work is such a big deal? is it a coding/space thing??? There's still a big grey empy slot at the bottom below the forums section that looks like wasted space... Having to scroll down a little bit isn't hard to do (my mouse is built with a scroll roller in between the buttons which makes it easy), especially now that you've change the premium user pics to 1 week on the top row.

The scren is to compact and an overload of pictures. It looks like a big cluster-fuck IMO the way it is. I like the titles and the captions (horizontal version) better because it gives you a little more info about what you'll be checking out before you check it out. It helped peak my interest and was an enticement to check out the new work. If I saw something I liked I'd click into it, whether or not the artist was a 'big namer.' I'm all about commenting on the newer folks work as well, because it gets them excited and helps them want to work more to make more stuff and better stuff...

I agree witht the auto-moving features. It's just visual overload. I think the arrow bars are a good Idea, but I still think there should be more then one 'Recently featured' on the screen at a time... Maybe have them scroll vertically instead of horizontally (like the auto-mode) and have it still show 3 or 4, and you can scroll to through 10 recent features.

Isn't having creative titles and captions and detail and definition (along with good glasswrork, and good photos) one of the criteria for raising your ranking in the Top 100? By hiding most of it on the front page makes it seem like adding all that is just extra work. If someone isn't too camera savvy, then chances are people won't click and check in to see what the rest of the work is because the only pic they see on the front page is a less then glamorous thumbnail, I think this takes away from the noobs when a snappy title and a little blurb about what's in the gallery or what colors were used might help draw people in...

Just some thoughts....

aLoha

[Dom]

Why is there such an importance to shorten up the front page? People cant use the scroll bar?

I personally find it very annoying that each section has its own scroll bar. If I use my mouse wheel to scroll down the whole page sometimes I get stuck in the forum posts.

The 3 box layout isnt so bad, but its horrible in its own box with a scroll bar, just looks hella messy.

I dont know what resolution people use but on my monitor GP is never wide enough, so Im sure you could shorten the page up by widening some stuff up a bit. Like the generations add, the title and description dont need to be 2 lines each.

The google adds, extremely annoying. Hopefully you get to the point where artists cover the cost of having stupid adds.

[Bryan]

I love GA and GP but i must say that the new version is harder to navigate.

heres my ideas.


I agree with Ben in that the new posts should be vertical not horizontal, i dont have a problem at all with longer web pages.. I found that i could instantly see the new posts the way justin used to have the layout. Now im not sure what ive looked at and its just a mess in my head. This is probably my biggest peev.... bc i instantly look for what is new and i just want to see it, not have to scroll through it.

I think the little graphics things where the catagories move in the top right on GP is cool but annoying as shit. I wont even search through there bc my eyes are moving too much when i scroll over that area with the mouse. I think a lot of the times as people visually look through a site they point with their mouse at what their looking at, when things move instantly with a rollover or whatever, it its frustrating bc i lose my place

ALso like what some others have said, The sponsored people that are always on top are now skipped through because ive assumed ive looked at that stuff already when sometimes i havent. Maybe put those guys on the left side where past features is with a slightly larger box... I guess that might look like the already featured galleries though?

As for the featured pics of the month. It was good to see them vertical as well. Now with the scroll through box i feel the "honor" isnt as much there. A person will no longer immediately see their pic (if featured) right on the front page when they sign on. Im assuming this helped keep the higher end content of this site flowing if anyone feels even remotely like i do. Now i cant even scroll through it, i have to wait to see what's there

I do like where the featured galleries is and especially brandons and pakohs stuff...its attractive to the eye and it changes every so often. If all those featured galleries changed pics once in a while that would be cool

Like glass i find that simplicity is sometimes the most attractive thing as long as its done well.

Bryan

[justin]

dbDom: Firefox + Adblock Plus = No google ads.

Ben: I think that having the info in the popup boxes is adequate, the user still has to see the popup before they can visit the page, and I'll be adding the feature/nominate buttons into those popup boxes. So the user will have more info before they click feature/nominate. Also I think we disagree on two fundamental things: First, I think more pictures and less text looks better. You seem to be indicating the opposite. Second, I think that shorter pages is better, and you don't. I have not been happy with the way things have gotten overwhelmingly tall as more and more stuff has been added to the site. I think it looks a LOT better that we're down to about 3 screens tall.

[jjglass]

Justin,

I'm assuming that you are using some Ajax on the site now. In typical Ajax fasion, some of the scripts are taking too long and dying on the vine in my browser, so sometimes the site works, sometimes it doesn't. Are you doing direct DB calls or are you calling a bunch of web services for the home page? If you have some WSDLs or a way to get a public feed, I could try to throw together a prototype.

[justin]

If you're getting the script hang problem, I'm working on that. Right now it seems to occur when I click on the picture of a black pendant on rice. It's some sort of endless loop in a string trimming function, not ajax related. There is a bit of ajax on the site and will be more but the front page does not use any yet. It will be used to load sets of images inside the popup boxes.

[Ben Burton Glass]

Out of curiosity, why are the titles above the pics still there on GP, but they've been removed from GA?

[PyroChixRock]

ooh it looks different from the last time I looked. i like the new scripts and moving features. you saved room well that way I think. I'm loving the shorter page.

[loydb]

the user still has to see the popup before they can visit the page

And you think this is a good thing? You've doubled the number of keyclicks it takes to get to a piece, which I suppose might be good for your click rating, but not much else...

And, IMO, a tall, functional page is way better than a short, crowded, busy, javascripted-until-it-bleeds page.

Like many here, I've gone from multiple views daily to 2-3 times/week.

[Jupiter]

it looks better today! maybe its time for a new background though.

justin, pm with a shipping address. i really appreciate all you have done for me and this community. id like to compensate you in some way. i cant afford any more monthly fees but i could hook you up with a piece for your shelf!

ps i hope all this gripping doesnt make any of us seem like were ungrateful. it just shows how much we love this site.

aloha Jupiter

[Bglass]

at first sight i was like???WTF but i love the site so much and been surfing it for six years that now its even starting to grow on me...
i like being able to come here and be updated on whats changing and going over there to actually see if it looks good or works. so thanks justin for keeping us informed and almost a part of the re-making of gp and ga.
i think losing the main script for the pieces while in the box makes almost every piece more classy and higher end, even the non nice pieces. i like how when you click on it it comes up, but for about two days it was a bitch trying to figure out how to open the pic to the gallery it was placed in. i just kept clicking and clicking, but now im used to it.

there are way more compact sites out there all jumbled so i guess im getting used to every one putting more stuff in front of your eyes more and more, its the Internet and a buis so watcha gonna do ya know. i get used to it.

tho i think the main box could be extended down more in length, its still hard to sift thru all the new to old stuff, before it was almost expected to see something new on the page but now if its new it just mixes in with everything else and the premium stuff.

with all the extra space length wise you should make a box on top of the main box just like the glass ads section. this box and area could be a good spot for premium users and they get exposure and we all get a clean "whats new box" below. i literally hate seeing those premium boxes over the top of the new stuff. always skip it and think it becomes boring and old like a day after, even with peoples rep and stuff posted.


being able to always see new stuff is like a insiders look into whats actually going on in out industry and lives. i love being able to be up to date with my friends and industry. to always see a old photo at he top featured premium users is like feeling nothings going on when there actually is. since the premium users pay for a service maybe they're little box could do something like alternate photos automatically directly from that peice thats featured for them that they chose. there is way more than one good pic in a single gallery so maybe it could scroll threw them and in turn it wouldn't be so boring to see the same peice even tho we know what and who it is....

there is a ton of stuff that could be done, all in all its good to see change i hate getting and being to comfortable all the time and think its vital to always step outside of your comfort zone and littlle box. good job and look forward to the progress in the site.

[bc]

ugh, that new add thing right in the middle of the new pics.....................ouch.

[Chris Carlson]

i felt like the new set up might really hurt the upstarts, looking for inspiration and encouragement, i use to really feel like it was a community board...

now it seems like a random picture gallery, with no sense of order, and a definite lack of personality compared with the old set-up..

its kinda sad to to see so much of your hard work, kinda disappear so to speak..

really discouraging, but encouraging to make sure and have your own outlet, somehow try an promote yourself outside of gp.... it looks the amazing sharing venue it once was, has gone by the wayside..

gp has done a lot for me in getting exposure, having a place to showcase and get feedback, plus, LOVED getting to post right after bearclaw, or JLEE, knowing that even though my piece was miniscule compared to their's, the people lookin at their stuff, had to see mine cradling it..

i LOVED the past features lurking on the sides, always seeing something of quality i might have missed earlier..

and honestly, having that ranked list right there when the main screen popped up, was huge motivator to make sure my name was there....

progress is subjective..change is inevitable..

i havent left a comment, nor gotten one since the debacle, havent posted, nor have i seen the normal influx of elite work, which i think drew the upstarts to want to be a part of it....

just wanted to show i care and give some input..

justin, seriously thank you for starting this site, and to the artists who made the site what it was..thank you all so much, it has given me so much... linked me up with my favorite pipers, and built a family of like minded crazies!!

i really hope the essence of what made it special is still there..

[$$$$$$$]

Well said Chris..

[Ben Burton Glass]

CC, I concur!

I still check both sites, and I've noticed the amount of work posted is much less, as well as the quantity of comments...

I'd also like to say 'Thank You Justin' for doing all you've done in the past and now to help build and bring our community together. It's truly appreciated even though some of us don't like the change as much...

Mahalo and Aloha!

[Hefe]

i agree with everything chris said. i really reallly miss the old gp setup.
i tried doing a search on it today and yesterday and it wont even search the site itself..seems like its searching for shit on google..not on gp.org.
i couldnt find any results for "disco"...yeah right!
i also couldnt find the artist list half the time, it moves around.
i really just want the old one back so bad..lol, its pretty much impossible to find anything on there anymore. i also miss the past features that they would show on the side..i miss it all..


ive seen it evolve from its very beginning (i think one of my pieces is the first ever feature on gp.org..not sure)..and i CANT possibly thank you enough justin..its an amazing site that we all couldnt live without. i just really miss alot of the great features that were there for many many years..and now i cant find them.

:( :( :(