Torch setup in rented basement. Landlord unhappy.

[sapipa12]

I built a reasonable setup in the basement of my rented house with a small hood venting through a basement window with a blower outside. I removed the window and replace with a piece of plywood with a cut hole. The tanks are outside with lines coming through a hole in the window.

I built this knowing the landlord may see it one day in hopes I could them ask him what he thought. (beg for forgiveness over permission) He came one day with only 15 min notice so I couldn't do anything to hide it. He wasn't pissed, recognized the safety precautions but said he doesn't want it there unless a fire marshall or someone OK's it. He also brought up the possibility of insurance issues.

I'm wondering if anyone has fought this battle before and if i should try to get someone to OK it or just give up and move it to somewhere else the person is OK with it. Not sure who I would talk to about local codes. Input or experience is welcome. Please ask me to clarify on any points if that would help, kind of in a hurry out the door but will check in later. Thanks all!

[Dragonharper]

Bottom line, it's his property and he has final say. First thing to do would be to contact a licensed plumber and have them come out and inspect. They should know all the local codes for LP and Oxy. Once you've brought the installation up to what the plumber says is code, then contact the fire marshal.

[phab]

...sounds like you still have some plus's going on for you there. the landlord seems to be open to it, on approval. ok, so get the fire dept to look at it. if there is a problem they will tell you how to correct it. the fire dept is gonna like you, you put your tanks outside. are they tied down?

when propane and 02 are in use they can be on the same cart, like an oxy acetylene setup. there is a difference between the regulations when the gases are in use as opposed to being stored awaiting use. dont say you sell your glass, "its just a hobby" will save you a lot of b.s.

oh the landlord should not have come there in 15 minutes notice, 24 hours is usually the rule but you have to chek your local regulations.

the insurance company will probably be ok with it once you have an ok from the fire dept. just go to your local firehouse tell them what you need might be easiest.
hope that helps

[Mecha]

^^What he said.

Also, if there is an increase in insurance for the owner, it should not really be that much. Offer to cover it by having it added to your rent. Divided into 12 months, it should be pretty reasonable and much cheaper than finding another spot.

[FredLight]

After my landlord saw my set-up he asked if I had a fire extinguisher, I said I have two, one on the bench and one next to the kiln (behind me).

He said he'd get the Fire Marshall down one day to check it out. It's been more than 5 years, and no further mention of it.

[Frankie Hess]

You can call the fire marshal ahead of time and ask what you need to do for it to be up to their codes, so when they come you have it done the way they want. You should be able to do it fairly easily. Especially if you're running K tanks and not liquid.

Phab's on the money about the hobby thing. Make it look like it's set up for a hobby as well, not some hard core production shop, and I think you'll be surprised how easy this will be for you.

[Greymatter Glass]

It's really stupid not to have Renters Insurance period, with a glass shop doubly so.

You might (probably) need a home business / workshop rider on it, contact your agent.

Basement glass studios are inherently dangerous. Carbon monoxide and propane are both heavier than air and will collect in a basement. You say you have a hood, that's great, but how do you get make-up air into the basement? Is there an exhaust extension that draws air off the floor?

As for code, chances are you will not pass an initial inspection, just do what they tell you after that and you should be good to go. The big things they're gonna look fo/at:

The floor. It has to be clear. No hoses or power cords running around. rubber lines cannot be used in a permanent fashion if they're allowed to touch the floor.

Fire prevention: Have at least 2 current fire extinguishers (ABC, Tagged, metal valve 10# or more). Buy the "better" ones from Home Depot, they're around $50-60 each.(18-20" high, metal valves) Take them to a fire station and have them tagged.

Exhaust: Because you're in a basement chances are they will make you install some form of floor-level exhaust system, as well as CO and Combustible Gas Detection. A CO alarm is about $40, a good gas detector is around $150 or so. I've seen all-in-one units as well somewhere...graingers maybe?

Plumbing: Hard line penetrations through any walls. Cannot have hoses run through a wall or window. Make sure there's a service disconnect/shutoff outside, clearly marked, for both gases.

There are other small things they can bother with, like what kind of teflon tape is used on gas lines, power ratings on breakers with kilns, regulators for propane, ingress/egress plans, markings for fire extinguishers, etc... but the ones above are the big ones I've seen them bother people over.

Good luck!

-Doug

[sapipa12]

Thanks for all the advice. After talking to a fire prevention person and the building permit office it looks like I need to befriend a plumber in order to see what it will take to get the gasses into the basement. The permit seems to require a licensed plumber/gas fitter to sign the permit before it can be submitted.

can of worms = opened.

:: drags torch setup outside to work for a bit in the wind ::

[phab]

Thanks for all the advice. After talking to a fire prevention person and the building permit office it looks like I need to befriend a plumber in order to see what it will take to get the gasses into the basement. The permit seems to require a licensed plumber/gas fitter to sign the permit before it can be submitted.

can of worms = opened.

:: drags torch setup outside to work for a bit in the wind ::

...dont get bummed out, if this is the only worm you got out of that can its not so bad. plus think of what a relief it will be knowing that youre straight with your landlord and you dont have to duck and hide to melt your glass. youll look back on this and have to squint your eyes to see it. just keep going forward.

[MUPH]

(beg for forgiveness over permission)

This was a mistake

[daveabr]

most places let you get away with anything, as long as you have "Flammable Gases" signs, and "Compressed Gas" signs posted on outer windows of shop.


atleast that's how it goes around here.

[knaz]

My local fire marshal said he didn't care what I did since it was a "hobby" situation. It's when it is a "business" that they clampdown. Maybe it is the same where you live?