gem stones...

[Chris Vargas]

I just read a thread about amethyst being encased in glass. I read that it can be done. Is there other gems or stones that can be encased? My grandpa has a bunch of different gem stones that he offered to let me use if I ever want to. I think it would be cool.

What stones have you used in glass, or have you heard being used in glass?

[Greymatter Glass]

I just read a thread about amethyst being encased in glass. I read that it can be done. Is there other gems or stones that can be encased? My grandpa has a bunch of different gem stones that he offered to let me use if I ever want to. I think it would be cool.

What stones have you used in glass, or have you heard being used in glass?

There are a LOT of threads about it already, I highly recommend that you use the search engine. search for encasing stuff, or something....

my short list from memory:

all quartzite, gilson opal, corundum, beryl, tourmaline, kyanite... work find

garnet, turquoise, magnets, real opals, magnetite, teeth, bones, starfish, shells, seedpods, and cell phones don't encase well (ok, the cellphone I only saw someone do on a video, don't try it)....

random pebbles from thr ground are hit-or-miss.

There were more... I spent a week or so randomly encasing everything I could find... I bought one of those posters with little mineral/crystal samples glued to it and did all of them.... about 30% survived.

-Doug

[Swampy]

I've previously put 4mm a/f zircon in a tube, melted that in placed it on a pendant with success.

[SeñorPyro]

re: the original post - amethyst is a type of quartz. typically, quartz can be encased with various outcomes. usually amethyst, citrine and other types of colored quartz lose their color and become cloudy when being encased. some don't like how it looks, others do, just preference. i second GreyMatter mostly except I do encase garnet, magnetite and real opals. the trick with magnetite (and most other iron bearing minerals) is that you need a really low temp so as to not boil out the iron. the trick to real opals are....welll...i can't give that one away...but it can be done.

about the other post, there are hundreds of minerals that can be encased despite what many say. I devote my glassblowing career to encasement of gems, minerals and extraterrestrial rocks. PM if you want more of an idea of what works (or doesn't).

and one last note, sometimes a certain mineral from one location in the world won't work, whereas the same mineral from a different location will. try multiple samples from various locations before you declare a certain mineral won't work. you would probably be surprised how different different samples can act.

[hashmasta-kut]

wow trippy, i want the real opal secret!

[smolder holder]

Preheat it in the kiln to drive the water out??

[Bugzy1972]

My bench mate is all about encasing different minerals. Her quartz encasements look great. She's also tried obsidian, mica flake, pyrite(sp?/stinky stuff), petrafied wood (didnt work too well) and many others. there are some great threads on this if you do a search

[Greymatter Glass]

i second GreyMatter mostly except I do encase ... real opals.

Sorry, I know you're new here and so I don't know your experience with glass and who you are in real life - perhaps we've met... so don't take it as too personal or harsh when I say this but....

I call bullshit. I will put $100 on it, and I suspect a few people I know would put more on it, to be proven wrong... but I have tried, and many people who make opal encasement a large part of their work have tried it....

If you've got a process that encases natural (mined) opal in hot glass show me some. Send me some for (possibly destructive) tests, if it's true I'll pay for it.

[Greymatter Glass]

Preheat it in the kiln to drive the water out??

With opal you end up with a hazy chunk of what looks like quartz, no fire, and usually it breaks up... try it. good opal isn't cheap.

[gypsea]

ask maestro...he knows about stones.....

[Greymatter Glass]

the "rocks" maestro knows about aren't the same thing...

[SeñorPyro]

greymatter sorry to hear you're such a debbie downer. i didn't say it was easy or that they even look as good as gilsons but it is very possible but it can be done with 2 different, certain chemical compositions of opal that i am aware of. all opal are not the same.

i sell my opal pieces pretty quick so there's none sitting around. all i have in my studio right now are some leftover opal experiments so i included a picture of them with the corresponding opals. notice they come out clear like crystal opal but were originally precious milk opal. the pendant contains potch opal and was not sold because of the gas ejection, another common problem. sorry this is all i have on hand but i think you get the point.

oh and fyi, i am a professional chemical engineer and self-taught lampworker with more than 9 years experience. My glass career is based on glass and mineral encasements, no pipes or anything else, just mineral encasements. you can keep that $100, i don't accept charity. Sorry to hear you're not more of a gentlemen greymatter.

re: gypsea, calcination and sintering can help with some opals but often hurts many. often the opal loses fire if it is precious, crazes or develops a dark haze. i hope this saves you some money.

[Greymatter Glass]

i didn't say it was easy or that they even look as good as gilsons but it is very possible but it can be done... notice they come out clear like crystal opal but were originally precious milk opal. the pendant contains potch opal and was not sold because of the gas ejection, another common problem. sorry this is all i have on hand but i think you get the point....
...

calcination and sintering can help with some opals but often hurts many. often the opal loses fire if it is precious, crazes or develops a dark haze. i hope this saves you some money.


With opal you end up with a hazy chunk of what looks like quartz, no fire, and usually it breaks up... try it. Good opal isn't cheap.


So I'm pretty sure I know exactly what results you're getting, as I've tried it a few times with results that weren't worth the effort.

I'm glad that you've made a market for yourself selling stuff encased in glass... I'm not going to say it's impossible to encase a natural opal in boro. I will reiterate that the result isn't very attractive, is problematic, it's hit or miss generally, and for the cost of natural opals vs. the result of gilson, there's no question which is a more viable option for encased opals...

If the end result is an "opal" with no fire, bubbles, crazing/splinters/fracturing and you're ok with that, and your customers understand what they're getting then more power to you, and don't let me stop you.




oh and fyi, i am a professional chemical engineer and self-taught lampworker with more than 9 years experience. My glass career is based on glass and mineral encasements, no pipes or anything else, just mineral encasements. you can keep that $100, i don't accept charity. Sorry to hear you're not more of a gentlemen greymatter.


Cool, I am a professional lampworker (11 years) and a self taught mechanical/chemical/nuclear/electrical/computer/physics evil scientist (20+ years). I actually have the TEOS and ammonia to make some gilson opals, just haven't found a still quiet space to leave it to settle for 12-18 months... and then I'd still need that arc furnace for proper sintering....


As for me being a gentleman...who said I was? I'm usually a nice guy, and I work to get along with people - but hey, sometimes I can be a total dick.

I'm still waiting for any proof that you've successfully encased a natural opal... but I also notice I didn't really state my qualifications for "successful" so here:

Encased stone with little to no trapped air.
No off-gassing from the stone itself.
No cracks or checks either in the stone or in the surrounding glass
No significant loss of color, fire, brilliance, or polish.

As an engineer you should understand that if you add enough heat to drive off water or change the molecular structure of a mineral you've produced a new material...which in the case of Opal you get silica.


...that said, yes, it IS possible to encase a natural opal in glass in a very litteral sense.....but all I see in your pictures is typical results - cracked hazy stones that aren't easily identifiable as opal unless it's marked as such... a curiosity and certainly of interest to other rock hounds and glass junkies... but not many people are going to be shelling out what that same opal would be worth mounted on a ring or as a loose polished stone... *shrug*


By the same definition of "encased" it's possible to encase virtually anything, even things generally not accepted as encasable ... it's important to qualify it with "cleanly encased" I guess...

-Doug

[FredLight]

I can piss halfway into the street from the curb.

Am I in?

J/K.

[SeñorPyro]

you are so in brotha man.

greymatter, gilsons are def the way to go. much easier and a better value.
but wheres the challenge?

[Greymatter Glass]

but wheres the challenge?

Talking Ross down by $5/gm, selling the end result, and finding good ones...

but really.. why's it got to be a challenge?

if you want a challenge find a way to encase a diamond in boro.... every time I've done THAT I just end up with a big bubble and some graphite.

[Kevin Bumble]

well, you could seal it in a tube and call it encased too ...........


so wheres my 100 bucks?
i got fire opal encasement right here.

[Ikensel]

Haha tru dat Kevin

[Alfred]

Kevin that tech is properly referred to as "encapsulation"

[kage]

i just encapsulated some keystones. almost got a sixer of tall boys encased in my stomache

[Waffles]

encase quartz, it looks cool as shit, tekites look cool to. preheat rocks to offgas them

[Greymatter Glass]

I just toilet encased last nights Chinese food... off to encapsulate some breakfast burrito...

[Aymie]

Corinne has successfully and cleanly encased natural opals. I will see if I can dig up a picture. I have had success with small cz's. Very small though. And pyrite works but the stink is the sulpher burning out and you are left with a chunk of iron. When I tried it the sulpher crystalized on the walls of the tube, smoked like a son of a bitch, and smelled like the worst egg fart ever.

I have a friend who does small snail shells and they are awesome.

No one seems to have mentioned labradorite. It works inside and if preheated can be attached to the outside.

[SeñorPyro]

Aymie, does your labradorite retain chatoyancy? I haven't found any that does yet, the sample i tried all turned grey.

and you hit the nail on the head with pyrite. a lot of sulfur ores/minerals will boil out. also, watch out for lead containing ores/minerals like wulfenite. i would highly suggest not trying to encase wulfenite due to the heavy lead exposure. just my two cents. might save you some medical bills down the line.

[Aymie]

It turned gray and rusty but reteined sparkle.

[SeñorPyro]

interesting, the stuff i tried was gray and rusty allright. but at least you got some sparkle. maybe it can be coupled with another mineral for better color, maybe something copper based like malachite were you get some nice fume.

re: the snail shells, are they fossilized? I've tried a few but they quickly vaporized.

[Aymie]

The shells we just tiny snail shells from his yard. Not sure how he got it to work.

[smolder holder]

I've tried shells collected from the ocean and they just disintigrated. Now encasing kittens on the other hand......

[Chris Vargas]

I've tried shells collected from the ocean and they just disintigrated. Now encasing kittens on the other hand......

lol... i saw that kittens in a bubble post... not so sure about that

[sertaiz]

what about just encasing the kitten for a minute as a demonstration on heat bases. aha.

[Bonz manifest]

re: the original post - amethyst is a type of quartz. typically, quartz can be encased with various outcomes. usually amethyst, citrine and other types of colored quartz lose their color and become cloudy when being encased. some don't like how it looks, others do, just preference. i second GreyMatter mostly except I do encase garnet, magnetite and real opals. the trick with magnetite (and most other iron bearing minerals) is that you need a really low temp so as to not boil out the iron. the trick to real opals are....welll...i can't give that one away...but it can be done.

about the other post, there are hundreds of minerals that can be encased despite what many say. I devote my glassblowing career to encasement of gems, minerals and extraterrestrial rocks. PM if you want more of an idea of what works (or doesn't).

and one last note, sometimes a certain mineral from one location in the world won't work, whereas the same mineral from a different location will. try multiple samples from various locations before you declare a certain mineral won't work. you would probably be surprised how different different samples can act.

"devote ur glassblowing career to encased gems"/.. thats cool, i would love to see ur work, where can i see ur stuff?

[SeñorPyro]

Here's some old stuff. I have a bunch on new products being photographed now, and getting posted soon. This work is kinda stale, I've been working with totally different stones and some new techniques lately. Keep an eye out for the new stuff. Cheers!

http://www.etsy.com/listing/73607445/stony-iron-meteorite-in-glass-cabochon

http://www.senorpyro.com/node/38

http://www.glassartists.org/SenorPyro

[Boozeclues]

Step #1
http://i9.photobucket.com/albums/a76/marlbromn30/blowsglass.jpg


step #2 Condense

step #3 $$$

[themoch]

Dear god... i always love step #3... it's always my favorite step

[FredLight]

I encased a fossilized Ammonite and made a marble with it to see if it would work. The guy that gave me the Ammonite bet me that it would work. If it worked, I told him he could have it.

He said put it in the kiln at 300F and take it out when it gets to 400F. I did that and successfully encased the Ammonite.

Since he was right, I gave it to him. I was not happy, but I handed it over.

About a month ago, he asked if I could fix it. I laughed and said any checks deep down would be irreparable. He said, " no checking, it split in half."

It stayed together for over 6 years with no signs of checking.

While we discussed it, he recalled how he loved how it looked like an opal. I said "like rainbow colors?"

He said "yeah, the shell's surface had a rainbow sheen".

I can only guess that was a sign of major stress.

[jac1961]

I was going to ask the doctor if they'd save my gallstones to see if someone could encase some in a marble... but then the thought of it grossed me out too much.