Abr sandblasting stencils

[glasstronaught]

So I figured i would give these a shot before I dropped the money on the photo resist system. Has anyone ever used these. I gotta think I'm doing something wrong as the vinyl gets andblasted off before I can even get a good etch in let alone get thru the top color. Maybe I should have read the instructions that came with it , but they have disappeared.

[kage]

you know, i bought some of those with my last abr order, just haven't used them yet. what are you trying to blast through? i mean what is the top color you speak of? might have something to do with it..

[glasstronaught]

A thin layer of satin slyme.

[glassnewb]

what pressure are you blasting at?

[re-vit]

it seems to me to take WAY to much time to blast through a layer of color to what's underneath. i was using powders and frits, and finding that by the time i was getting good color saturation on the outer layer, that layer was 2-3mm thick. this is nothing like knocking off a microscopic layer of fume and calling it "ready to sleeve." after a few millimeters, the rayzist is shot. what i'd like to try someday is achieving highly saturated colors but thin layers with (hopefully) compatible enamels.

i digress! i've used vinyl peel and stick letters a lot with good results, but only on fume. the photo stuff feels less sticky, but actually sticks better than vinyl, IMO.
also, while the etching creams get laughed at by the boro, they work great taking off fume if you don't have access to a blaster. this technique is where vinyl works great. rayzist won't work for a chemical etch, because the "open" areas of the mask aren't really open (there's an almost invisible carrier layer that gets blasted apart.)

[glasstronaught]

Around 100 psi. It's a pain in the ass because my compressor is to small for this stuff. Want a bigger one but don't have the loot.

[Aussie]

I use signmaker's vinyl (never used the ABR stencils, are they the same material?) and had a similar problem, expecially with very small pieces of it which aren't connected to anything. I got a bit frustrated so I tried the following:
Do you have a hair dryer or paint stripper heat gun? Once in position and stuck in place, blast the vinyl with hot air, but be careful, don't get it or the glass too hot. The heat from the dryer/gun will soften the adhesive and also the vinyl for a while. Press it down and push out any bubbles or folds, then let it cool down. You'll find the vinyl becomes more rigid after cooling than it was before and it sticks a lot better.
Then blast to your heart's content!

I get some reasonably fine and crisp lines doing it this way (see below). This is blasted through about 0.5 to 1mm of top colour.
If your mask still blasts off, try less pressure, it takes longer but there's less stress on the mask as well as the glass.

[daveabr]

we sell the blaster ammo, and do customs. never had any issues with either. we'll be happy to help ya out if you determine it's the stencils. we've never had a return or anything on them before though.

[Aussie]

Almost forgot to mention, make sure you clean your glass well. Paw prints don't help with the sticking!

[glasstronaught]

Thanks worked great Aussie repp on the way.

[B-Rye-oNeR]

what blast media are you using.? I use Silica carbide, the finest grit ABR sells, and it works faster/better than anything I've ever seen, never had a problem with any vinyl masking.

[Aussie]

Thanks worked great

:peace:

[Forche]

^Silica carbide is fucking nasty stuff.I use garnett and 100 psi is WAY too high...I blast mine at 35 on a siphon system.

[EFS]

100 psi is for very deep multi stage carving into thick glass. Tone it down to the 35 ish range like josh is saying.

[B-Rye-oNeR]

I agree it is nasty,...fer sure

[Aussie]

But so much more benign on the glass!

[Robert Mickelsen]

Blasting PSI is system-dependant. If you are using a siphon system, higher pressures are necessary no matter what the medium is. Typical pressures for a siphon system range from 60 to 100 PSI. For a pot system, the pressures needed are much lower - typically 20 - 40 PSI. This might explain the disparity between what people are reporting here. None of you make any mention of what kind of system you have.

If it is taking a very long time to achieve what you want, you are doing something wrong. Sandblasting should be an efficient way to create images whether you are blasting through thin surface reduction or a layer of color. Keep your color layers under 2mm thick for best results.

Silicon Carbide is a superior medium for blasting than aluminum oxide. It blasts faster and lasts longer. Both are nasty if you get it in your lungs. Wear a respirator.

I use a wash-out, glue-on photomask. I have tried the no-wash-out, no-glue-on masks, but found them to be problematic. The glass has to be perfectly clean or the stick won't work properly. And it is difficult to detect poorly exposed masks because you are looking at a color change instead of a space in the mask. You won't find out if your exposure was a good one until your piece is blasted. The old-fashioned rinse-out, glue-on masks eliminate both of these issues.

That said, there are many who achieve excellent results using the no rinse, no glue masks. Slinger is a perfect example. My advice is to try them both and use what works best for you.

- RAM

[EFS]

I use a pressure pot system

[glasstronaught]

I got it down now I think 80 psi is about right for my siphon feed set up and heating up the vinyl works great to keep it from blasting off.
Eventually I want to get the letralite and use the photo masks for more detailed design.

[themoch]

i was using 25 psi on a pressure pot system and using 220 grit -- Silicon Carbide.

i could carve about 2mm deep in about 8 seconds.

I also use the R3 and R5 from Ikonics (https://ikonicsimaging.com/wp/product/r3-r5/)

[kage]

Just thought I'd ask here...I've been using aluminum oxide out of convinience, but I'm running low and need more media/grit. If I were to switch to silicon carbide, could I mix the two grits or should I empty out all of the aluminum oxide first?

[Forche]

I would...I bet one is harder than the other and would leave pits or something. But I would look into Garnett cause carbide is so nasty...it just gets EVERYWHERE.

[kage]

Yeah I guess that was a dumb question. I've been using 70grade a.o.
What grade garnet do you use?

And 220 moch? I would not have guessed that would blast that deep. I'm only removing 1mm mostly, but I did have some failed experiments (same as op) with about 2-3mm of fine frit over black tube. I couldn't get through the frit at all on some pieces, took half an hour on some others.

[EFS]

i wouldnt switch the two. silicon carbide last longer but is more expensive. i think it works much better as well as it keeps re sharpening itself where almuinum oxide starts to round out. plus silicon is electrical charged so it isnt so dusty in your cabinet. i use 180 myself and do highly detailed images so 220 is overkill.

[Darkcorner]

I have 70g aluminum oxide, but ive only used it once and it destroyed the vinyl, I was also doing 80psi on a siphon so I know to lower that. Is my 70g aluminum too coarse?

[Zed]

Try the "non membrane" Razist photoresists, they do not have the membrane and will work for acid etching. There is no carrier for the film though, so avoid images with free floating imagery. I was acid etching dichro for a while and I had good results using a iron to slightly melt the resist so that it would stick to the flat glass without the need for glue which interfered with the etch-all. I don't know how you could do something like this for round glass, but I'll bet its possible, maybe a heat gun or something. Good luck.




it seems to me to take WAY to much time to blast through a layer of color to what's underneath. i was using powders and frits, and finding that by the time i was getting good color saturation on the outer layer, that layer was 2-3mm thick. this is nothing like knocking off a microscopic layer of fume and calling it "ready to sleeve." after a few millimeters, the rayzist is shot. what i'd like to try someday is achieving highly saturated colors but thin layers with (hopefully) compatible enamels.

i digress! i've used vinyl peel and stick letters a lot with good results, but only on fume. the photo stuff feels less sticky, but actually sticks better than vinyl, IMO.
also, while the etching creams get laughed at by the boro, they work great taking off fume if you don't have access to a blaster. this technique is where vinyl works great. rayzist won't work for a chemical etch, because the "open" areas of the mask aren't really open (there's an almost invisible carrier layer that gets blasted apart.)