14x20 or 14x23

[HeartBurnGlass]

so the place im ordering joints from gives me the option of 14x20 mm or 14x23mm for ground joints. what I want to know is which out of the two is the "standard" . I know it doesnt make that big of a difference but I figured for people who use domes the TI nails are made to fit a specific size so I would like to have my pieces conform to that standard. search engine didnt bring anything up so I thought I'd ask, thanks.

[hashmasta-kut]

i always buy 14/23, i figure domeheads prolly do the same, i am sure some will chime in.

[HeartBurnGlass]

Im a little confused because the place I usually order from only has 14x20 but I know people who order from mountain glass and theirs are listed at 14x23. we compared the joints we get and there isnt really a difference. But we were looking into making a large order from a new supplier and they offer both sizes.

[daveabr]

The difference started a long time ago. Simax always made 14/20 joints, schott/lenz always had 14/23's. There is very little difference, but I think that was where it started from. The Indian joints are mostly labeled as 14/23's, as their whole purpose was to compete with the Lenz joints.


I think Simax makes both sizes these days, but are very hard to get stocked on in the Simax

[Din]

I think that the different is not in the diameter of the mouth of the joint, but in the height of the taper. 14/23 provides more surface area to grip than 14/20, but provides the same diameters, so to some degree the parts are interchangable, but a better grip is provided by 14/23. Or I'm completely wrong and talking out of my ass, I don't know. Wait... typing out of my ass.

[hashmasta-kut]

they both sit flush in each other, its just how far the male will go down into the female. if you use a long male and a short female there will be male ground joint below where the female ground part ends, and if you use a short male in a long female, there will be a section of ground glass on the female joint that is not filled by the male, as the male will be 3mm shorter.

[gn0me]

Just for clarification, the first number in ground joint sizing is the diameter in mm of the widest part of the taper - the mouth of a female joint and the shoulder of a male joint... the second number is the length of the ground area, starting from the same point. Availability seems to change by retailer and manufacturer, but all 14's will fit each other (theoretically - a bad grind is a bad grind no matter who makes it) as would 18's/19's for the most part (a 19 will stick out of a 18 just a bit, but it's more of a finish issue. Sometimes it seems 18's may just be mislabeled or ground a bit too much). The difference would be either the male sticking too far into the female or not far enough and most nails should work with either - at least, any nail that works with 14/23 should work with 14/20's wider opening. You do also want to be careful what tubing the joint was made with, because some 14mm joints are made on 13x1.5mm tubing, which can be too thin in some applications.

[Kevin Bumble]

yes 13x1.5 too thin^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ and + on how they are sized

[HeartBurnGlass]

thanks for the input everyone, I understand how the sizing works and how they fit together, my main concern is that the 14x23s are longer so technically wouldnt that mean the opening is smaller being that it is further down the taper? (im only focusing on male joints ) im not worried about how deep they sit in a female, its mostly for when I make domes because alot of people prefer to use TI nails so I wanted to know if either size works with the standard TI nail. im assuming they will work with both though.

[Din]

Hey look, three consecutive posts saying the same thing! Anyway, the mouth will be the same in both joints.

[byron3]

The big difference is the short grinds are used for glass sats and other glass objects along those lines .................

The short tapers just look cleaner ................IMHO

Others must think the same as those are the applications I see them in most frequently.

B3