DIY Furnace for LIQUIDUS Glass!!!

[DildoBaggins]

Does anyone know of any DIY/homemade ways that glass can be taken to total liquid form?

I've already made DIY kiln but im wanting what you stick a blowpipe into to get started on a large object, not something used for annealing.

This is without a doubt the hardest thing to replicate with a DIY project, but that's only more of a reason to do so brah!

[Shapeshifter]

In my opinion Molybdenum Disilicide (MoSi2) glass furnaces (Moly) are the best electric furnaces they can go up to a much higher temperature than a wire melter and moly furnaces are way more reliable. I have worked out of a moly furnace for years with no problems. Here is a link to a moly furnace build http://www.wetcanvas.com/forums/showthread.php?t=494063
There are also professionals that build nice units like a company in Portland Oregon called Canned Heat
http://cannedheatglass.virb.com/

[DildoBaggins]

Lol jesus christ that's awesome but really expensive, im looking for the cheap route though, for instance i've seen youtube videos of people torching a spot on a piece of glass and then microwaving it, which ends up totally melting a hole in it somehow. This makes me wonder if i can just torch a steel cup full of glass and then microwave it to liquidus temps? I'd test it right now but i fear for Mr. Microwave's life!

[Shapeshifter]

Microwave? Did I read that correct? Are you planning on putting a metal cup full of glass in the microwave to try to melt it to a liquid? I thought you were looking for info on building a furnace. What you are describing is the by far the JANKEST shit I have ever heard. I hate to offer any advise on your plan but instead of a metal cup in the microwave a graphite one probably would not spark and start a fire. this is such a waste of time good luck

[DildoBaggins]

No i mean I wouldnt put metal in the microwave, ignore that error of my speaking, i was thinking more about metling points and containing the glass, but i literally just watched a video of someone causing a beer bottle to become liquidus by torching a spot on it and microwaving it. Very interesting stuff!

I'm not saying this is how to build a DIY furnace, im saying maybe the science here can be applied to come up with an alternative that produces somewhat of the same effect

Look at what Im talking about and instead of calling it trashy, ignore the trashiness and think of how you can apply the science, i mean, thats the best thing to do here.

Here's the video I was talking about
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IX7OZFu1Un8

[menty666]

What does "liquidus" mean?

[Jimi The Don]

i can't wait to see where this thread goes!

[D. dino i ninjah]

Wow .. the original post .. and then .. the second with serious good information .. and then the microwave and tin can.. shit.. wow .. fucking best post of the year.. this is quality..

[Bo Diddles]

I've melted glass in a microwave in a metal cup... Several times.

[Dan Kooper]

What does "liquidus" mean?

It means in a fully liquid state.


Wiki:
The liquidus temperature, TL or Tliq, is mostly used for glasses, alloys and rocks. It specifies the temperature above which a material is completely liquid,[1] and the maximum temperature at which crystals can co-exist with the melt in thermodynamic equilibrium.

[menty666]

It means in a fully liquid state.


Wiki:
The liquidus temperature, TL or Tliq, is mostly used for glasses, alloys and rocks. It specifies the temperature above which a material is completely liquid,[1] and the maximum temperature at which crystals can co-exist with the melt in thermodynamic equilibrium.

Well huh, my something new for the day.

[talonst]

I do this all the time - usually goes faster if I put the metal cup in the microwave then wrap the microwave in tin foil and put that in the oven.

[istandalone24/7]

^^yea but you have to put two raw, uncracked eggs in there too. something about the eggs create a neutral flame....helps avoid reduction issues.

[khan]

sometimes my girlfriend gets all liquidus...
umm

Khan

[jr23]

The microwave extrusion crucible.

Already done , they load up the 3 chambered crucible then throw a glob of molten clear on top.

At the five minutes it starts shitting out clear cased reversal tube.

Do to the spinning plate. If you want reg line tube you take out plate.

[talonst]

and here I thought liquidus was comicus' sidekick . . .

[DildoBaggins]

No no no dont disregard the seriousness of the thread just because of a mistake I made in writing, I even showed the video of the glass melting in there, I dont care about what you think is stupid, this is science. It's a small practical part of reality that I'm trying to make larger so I can use it as a tool to circumvent any obstacles such as the money, lack of accessibility, lack of privacy, and much more.

If you're not going to take this seriously, then follow this URL to where you belong... boards.4chan.org/b/

[Din]

What does "liquidus" mean?

I think Liquidus is the new guitar player for Gwar.

[kq9ak]

Using a microwave is not to far fetched. Those microwave kiln things are pretty bad ass for fusing boro. Don't see why something could not be home brewed using microwave parts with a crucible and a lid on top to dip into.

[kq9ak]

http://www.delphiglass.com/glass-kilns-accessories/small-kilns/fuseworks-microwave-kiln

Put some thought into the idea presented awhile back. If you made a larger microwave kiln, not easy cause I believe it is done in a vacuum mold, that could be surrounded by 2 or more micro ave elements. Building outside case out of brick to hold temperature better with a top for accesses crucible. The rate at which you could get glass molten would be so much faster. Just cause its not available for sale somewhere doesn't mean it could not be done.

[DildoBaggins]

Alright, well so far it seems as though the only cheap way of making a DIY furnace is to use microwave radiation.
What I learned from research and the video are that...

-glass melts in the microwave after being torched
-microwave radiation works on WATER MOLECULES in the microwaved material
-plasma sparks can be a problem

One of the biggest concepts here is that adding water to the glass will make this idea FAR more effective.

I'm thinking that you could take out the microwave's radio device and then make a larger inside cooking area for it so that the plasma sparks can't reach the inner walls, maybe even with stronger walls and such so that plasma sparks cannot damage them, and glass can just melt at the bottom I bet, as long as the door doesn't reach down to the bottom of it, then this can be totally possible. The only thing that might go wrong is that with a larger inside to the microwave, a larger corresponding amount of radiation may be required. I've read that a microwave operating while opened has no effect on lab rats in the same room, as for the plasma, IDK anything about that, but I'd just say stay back lol. Maybe the radiation emitting device in a microwave can be taken out and used in open air near the glass?

I got my information from some guy on Yahoo here lol seems legit doe "http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20080830212330AAGTBsZ"

Another idea for larger scale:
I'm wondering if a DIY microwave can be made, so that more powerful radioactivity can be produced (can't be expensive, I'd imagine), and this could be put into a larger space closed area (I guess walled with whatever a normal microwave is walled with inside) so that the plasma sparks would have too much distance to travel before they reached the device's inner walls to damage it.

[somewhere]

Microwave melting makes absolutely no sense. The energy conversion is terrible.

That said in 2002 at the international gas conference they had a microwave furnace. It produced poor quality glass but was quiet the novelty. There are far better and easy ways to melt glass.

[DildoBaggins]

It produced poor quality glass but was quiet the novelty. There are far better and easy ways to melt glass.

I mean if it melts it melts dude, and if you know of far easier and better was to melt glass then why aren't you saying any of them?

What is the cheapest way to have glass so hot that it is in a liquidus state?

[kq9ak]

Somewhere..do u have any ideas on how it was made? Just wondering if their could be improvements to the design. I am sure the first furnace ever made using gas or electric elements was not perfect and has been improved on over time. How was the glass poor? Air bubbles?.

Didobaggins.....The microwave kilns use a metallic coating which gets hot raising the temperature in the enclosure. No preheating to excite the molecules or water needed.

As to the energy use question depends on the purpose. If you were looking to have molten color to dip in than electric element kiln is probably best. If you wanted to recycle glass to make something, maybe poor crucible into a mold, this would be very efficient.

[somewhere]

I mean if it melts it melts dude, and if you know of far easier and better was to melt glass then why aren't you saying any of them? What is the cheapest way to have glass so hot that it is in a liquidus state?

Your torch. Would be the easy short answer.

Resistive elements or gas. I've built many furnaces it's not rocket science. The info is all out there easily attainable. It really doesn't make sense for me to teach you how in this thread. Do your homework and I'm happy to help trouble shoot or help find materials.

[DildoBaggins]

If you wanted to recycle glass to make something, maybe poor crucible into a mold, this would be very efficient.

Basically I would love to be able to take it out of the microwave still in liquid form and dip a blowpipe into it, instead of having a massive furnace, so I could do this at home.

What kind of crucible would hold the glass in the microwave without igniting/ Most of these are made of metal and obviously that wont work...

[DildoBaggins]

Resistive elements. I've built many furnaces it's not rocket science. The info is all out there easily attainable. It really doesn't make sense for me to teach you how in this thread. Do your homework and I'm happy to help trouble shoot or help find materials.

Well I've only seen them being in the costs of thousands, whereas kins are easy to make, I've made one of those but I've never seen a cheap DIY furnace...

[somewhere]

Somewhere..do u have any ideas on how it was made? Just wondering if their could be improvements to the design. I am sure the first furnace ever made using gas or electric elements was not perfect and has been improved on over time. How was the glass poor? Air bubbles?. Didobaggins.....The microwave kilns use a metallic coating which gets hot raising the temperature in the enclosure. No preheating to excite the molecules or water needed. As to the energy use question depends on the purpose. If you were looking to have molten color to dip in than electric element kiln is probably best. If you wanted to recycle glass to make something, maybe poor crucible into a mold, this would be very efficient.

Yes I know how it was made and it is about the equivalent of running 10 microwaves. The furnace only held a small amount of glass. What made it special was the engineering of the temp control.

You use the word efficient but it's far from it. With out a lot of engineering and inventing you will never have any usable glass. Regardless of how inefficient this path is the quality of the glass does matter.

Down this road lies the path of madness. IMO you might as well start producing browns gas.

[somewhere]

Well I've only seen them being in the costs of thousands, whereas kins are easy to make, I've made one of those but I've never seen a cheap DIY furnace...

Keep looking tons of diy info on these small melters. It's nothing more then a better insulated kiln with some better refractories on the hot face.

[DildoBaggins]

Keep looking tons of diy info on these small melters. It's nothing more then a better insulated kiln with some better refractories on the hot face.

Well is there a different name other than "DIY glass furnace" and the like that I should be searching for? Sometimes a single search term makes a world of difference.

[somewhere]

Well is there a different name other than "DIY glass furnace" and the like that I should be searching for? Sometimes a single search term makes a world of difference.

Try this:

http://bit.ly/1ccyy5X

[somewhere]

http://www.mayneislandglass.com/40poundfurnace.htm

[menty666]

Basically I would love to be able to take it out of the microwave still in liquid form and dip a blowpipe into it, instead of having a massive furnace, so I could do this at home.

What kind of crucible would hold the glass in the microwave without igniting/ Most of these are made of metal and obviously that wont work...


You do understand that once the microwave switches off the glass immediately starts losing temperature, right?

Think of it on a slightly lower temperature scale. Put some cheese in glass measuring cup, microwave it for 3 minutes and take it out. It's liquid at that point, sure. Check every 5 seconds to see what it's doing as far as setting up and you'll see what'll happen to your glass.

"Well I'll just leave the microwave on!" you might say.

Consider that annoying mesh screen inside the door of the microwave that ruins your view of your nachos. That's there to help act as a bit of a Faraday cage and disrupt the waves of energy being fired at your food so they don't fire at you. If you leave the microwaves components running while you dip your pipe in the crucible, you're going to risk hurting yourself in ways that make burning look desirable.

While I appreciate your ambition, either using a traditional gas fired furnace or an electric melter is going to be safer and more efficient than trying to set a torch to a small amount of sodalime glass and trying to melt it down in the microwave.

[DildoBaggins]

Do you think that a small one that goes up to 2000 degrees Fahrenheit is good enough for working with soft glass/soda lime?

All of these furnaces on google are way too expensive for the home. I understand there are DIY ones out there but this one here really seems to be what I'm looking for, if it can keep the glass liquidus at 2000 Fahrenheit of course...
http://www.instructables.com/id/Homemade-Electric-Kiln/?ALLSTEPS
I can't find the other one from wetcanvas I was gonna link here...

[DildoBaggins]

That's there to help act as a bit of a Faraday cage and disrupt the waves of energy being fired at your food so they don't fire at you. If you leave the microwaves components running while you dip your pipe in the crucible, you're going to risk hurting yourself in ways that make burning look desirable.

I've seen some legit seeming quotes from the yahoo answers page I linked that lab rats were unaffected in a room with an open microwave.

[jr23]

Sorry to crush your dreams.

Its not going to work.

If you want to dip glass you need sufficient glass to dip into.

Once you downsize to a certain point it will cool to fast to get the dip done.

Then you have to look at waste glass.

If you keep downsizing you will have more glass stuck to the pot than you get to use.


If you think about it all this time wasted on your idea could be put towards learning the fundamental skills of glassblowing. Then you could use your skill and earn a crucible kiln.

Think a crucible kiln is pricey start buying the color to fill them all the time.

[istandalone24/7]

OP...check the 2nd item down on this page:
http://www.devardiglass.com/supplies.htm

this will be the cheapest way to melt soft glass....but i'm pretty sure it wont' reach "liquidus" status. for $60 it's worth a shot though.

[kq9ak]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZJvCuGmRWL8&feature=youtube_gdata_player

Make it larger to hold crucible, with multiple microwave elements.
Even though its been apperently been tried before, never hurts to try. How many light bulbs were made before the proper combination is found.

How does saying, that's not going to work help , without actually. trying.

[menty666]

I love the wire cutters for cutting glass LOL

http://www.devardiglass.com/meltingpot.htm

[istandalone24/7]

i saw those...pretty bad. although i do have a couple of Devardi's claw grabbers...which are of surprisingly good quality.

[menty666]

I got the grabbers too, they're not bad.

[Din]

I've seen some legit seeming quotes from the yahoo answers page I linked that lab rats were unaffected in a room with an open microwave.
(Italics added)

...walled with whatever a normal microwave is walled with inside...
Research skillz.
Also this:

Maybe the radiation emitting device in a microwave can be taken out and used in open air near the glass?
...is fucking hilarious.

[DildoBaggins]

(Italics added)

Research skillz.
Also this:

...is fucking hilarious.

A girl can dream, you know.

Honestly i know that sounds dumb but microwaves can safely be operated while opened, proven in the link i provided, and all parts that produce the "micro" "waves" can be taken out and used on whatever theyre being used on. I didnt write this so that people could criticize how I write things or talk. Discouraging people from thinking for themselves and being creative, trying to learn more about what they dont understand and putting it to good use, makes you a real shit of a person.

I have no idea why I take shitposts so srsly here, when I've been a 4chan lurker in my past.

[DildoBaggins]

Look at this, http:// http://www.wetcanvas.com/forums/showthread.php?t=358343

do you think that'd be enough to dip a blowpipe into and catch enough glass or no? Well... i mean i could this same thing on a slightly larger scale in order to make it possible if it's not quite big enough for dipping and catching yet, at least the designer/creator says its his gloryhole

[menty666]

You could certainly try it, and Mark's come up with some crazy DIY stuff in the past that works great.

Most folks here will never tell you not to try something, providing you're not going to hurt yourself or others (mostly the latter). Go forth, prove us all wrong and sell us a working microwave crucible kiln.


The problem you're going to run into is the return on investment. For the amount of glass you might heat up with a residential microwave emitter (you did specify you wanted cheap, so I assumed you're hitting up a tag sale for a used POS microwave), you may as well just do it in the torch. Crucibles break down fast because molten glass is caustic, so you'll be replacing those pretty often.


If you really want to play, get a thick iron pot to use as a crucible and consider making an induction furnace. Overall it might be cheaper R&D and less likely to accidentally cook your genitals.

[glassy1]

http://www.delphiglass.com/glass-kilns-accessories/small-kilns/fuseworks-microwave-kiln

Put some thought into the idea presented awhile back. If you made a larger microwave kiln, not easy cause I believe it is done in a vacuum mold, that could be surrounded by 2 or more micro ave elements. Building outside case out of brick to hold temperature better with a top for accesses crucible. The rate at which you could get glass molten would be so much faster. Just cause its not available for sale somewhere doesn't mean it could not be done.

Hi I have the invention you need.
http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/Glassblowing-studios-studio-furnace-plans-for-D-I-Y-World-First-Patented-6-in1-/171664294926
https://www.facebook.com/Mobilehotglass?ref=bookmarks
https://www.facebook.com/david.palmer.73

[gomilobster]

Think a crucible kiln is pricey start buying the color to fill them all the time.

This.... I really loved this whole idea of having a bench top dipper myself, but when it comes down to it in order to have a pot big enough to make it worth while (product vs waste etc)... I learned the actual crucible kiln is the cheap part of the whole thing... When some colors I would want to use are 80 to 100 $ a lbs and I would need 10 to 20 lbs... for one color/run well... I realized that the glass would cost near as much as the crucible itself.

[MondoGlass]

Very good point. Well said. You could try making your own colour glass with a crucible and the right chemicals.