Setting up my first real studio, could use some advice!

[optic]

Hey guys!
Alright so im back, and i have a few more beginner questions as far as getting started.
A little background on me, I took an off-hand glassblowing class at my uni and fell in love with the medium, I will be taking more uni level classes over the next few years, however none of them focus on lampwork, which is likely what i will want to do in the longrun. Over december and early january I went home, and thanks to the help of some members here, especially SkipJack, I was able to get a little hothead set up for bead making. I loved it imediately and spent at least 3 hours a day cranking out beads. I feel that i had a good progression of skill considering i was entirely self taught.

Now Im looking towards summer break and preparing to upgrade my torch and set up a little semi-permanent "studio" in my backyard. I have a covered deck in my backyard, I was planning to add at least two walls to block out some sunlight as well as divert gusts of wind, and then building a large plywood table to act as a workstation.

Im trying to save up as much money as possible, I ran some numbers and, assuming i dont drastically overspend over the next few months, I should be able to save up around 2000$ from my job alone. Im also in the process of quitting cigarettes, and should i succeed thats an extra 4k a year in my pocket (hopefully another 1k by summer break)
Ive only done a basic amount of research, but from my understanding the likely breakdown of what i need is:
torch:500+
Flashback arrestors+gauges: 200
Tools (i already have a few): 150
Ventilation: 150+
kiln: 600+
Oxy tank: ~100?
glass: xxx(whatever money i have left)
total:1700+ (lowballing) to 3000 (depending on available funds)

Now for my questions.

1. Torch. Ive worked soley on a HH so far (THANKS SJ!) and despite what literally everyone told me, i wasnt too frusturated by it.Towards the end i started to notice its failures, and started having issues with burning colors, but my main complaint was that the flame is impossible to see prior to sunset (is this an issue with all torches? how can it be remedied?) I feel that it served me well, and i learned a lot from my 4 weeks on the flame. However it is definitely time to upgrade. I want to start to move towards boro, and start to work on more precise applications, and more advanced color techniques.

GTT seems to be the brand most recomended. Ive also heard a few recomendations for nat 3s and redmaxes, however GTT seems to have a much larger following. I was looking at the Lynx, mainly because it seems to be the universal "I wish i had started on a..." torch, however im wondering what the difference is between the Lynx and the Cheetah, the price difference isnt too large and I could likely afford the cheetah if its worth it. any pros and cons between the two?

The other torch im looking at is the 4 stud phantom. Unless i run into a pile of cash the only way i could afford this is if i didnt get a kiln, and then Id have to start looking at foot pedals and oxy concentrators too, but I imagine if i started here I wouldnt need to mess around with any other torches for at least a few years right?

Any advice? any other recomendations? is a kiln more important than a nice torch at this stage in my progression?

2. Ventilation. I know this is extremely important. I know this is highly overlooked. I know this is a great failure of many begining glassblowers. That said Ive found next to nothing that coherently explains the basics of ventilation. I now i need exhaust and intake.
Are my ventilation requirements the same even though my studio is semi-open/ outdoors?
Any advice as far as what fans/models to look for?

3. Kiln. This is the big ? in my setup. I know very little about kilns, I know a few people who have used cramics kilns that i could probably score for fairly cheap, but would these be of any use for glass? Furthermore I realize that the kiln you choose is highly dependant on what your doing with it, and im very conflicted there. In my mind The majority of my work will likely be production pipes and whatnot, but at some point id like to try some larger scale more "heady peices" however I will likely always be doing some amount of work on soft glass, as spectrum 96 is highly available to me, so something like a bead door would be really beneficial (idk if thats a help or a hindrance for pipes. On top of that I will be take multiple classes on slumping, fusing, casting, and just general kiln formed glass over the next few years, and i imagine it would be fun/ inspirational if I had the ability to carry on with some of those techniques when i return home. Is there any kiln that could fill all of these needs for less than 1500$?

However, another thing i am considering is wether a kiln is something I even need right now. Would I benefit more from skipping on the kiln, buying a nicer torch (phantom?) building up my skills, and then saving up to get a kiln for the next break from school?

Any sugestions?

Thank you all for your help, I cant wait to start on boro.....

[BORO]

http://www.talkglass.com/forum/showthread.php?50425-Attention-new-lampworkers-READ-FIRST&highlight=read+first

Sounds like you have a idea what you need.

[optic]

http://www.talkglass.com/forum/showthread.php?50425-Attention-new-lampworkers-READ-FIRST&highlight=read+first

Sounds like you have a idea what you need.

Thank you, that thread was very helpful, especially the tool lists. However, it seems to parrot the same advice I've heard over and over which is "You need all of this and the bigger the better" I understand this, but I lack the hands on experience to know realisticallly how the varying levels will effect me. For example, If i were to get the phantom, would I be thankful for it within 2 months? or would i pretty much just use the center lynx for 6 months+ before I reached the point where I could start to utilize the outer ring occasionally?

I understand the annealing process fully, I spent four months in a glassblowing class loading peices into a giant annealer every single day, ive seent he peices that "survived" the drop off bucket crumble hours later under a gust of wind... This being said, I don't know how long it will take me to begin making "acceptable" spoons. If the time of progression to reach the point of making 10+ retail peices is less than 3 months then a kiln is a 100% necessity for me. However, if I'm not going to make a single peice over 4+months that Id personally choose over the handful of cheap pipes and bubs that i already own, I might go for a phantom instead. If its going to take me all of summer break to reach the point of making decent quality spoons then Id rather allow them all to shatter and die so that I can squeeze in the maximum amount of practice and skill development possible in the short amount of time I have. Id definitely be able to make over 1000$ before winter break then, possibly allowing me to also get a much nicer kiln then I would have otherwise.

This would leave me in a position so that by christmas Id ideally be skilled enough to begin low level production, as well as making a few personal pipes to cherish. Id have a torch good enough to accomadate pretty much any technique/idea I want to move on to, and i could possibly have a kiln that suits all of my needs and will last me for a long time.

Ive read the "get it all and the bigger the better advice" countless times on here. Im asking these questions because I want a personal response to my unique situation from someone with experience. What I explained in the paragraph above is how the "ideal situation" plays out in my mind, but Ive never touched a torch bigger than a HH, Ive never melted boro, and Ive never run a kiln, so I have no idea if Im being naive/ overly zealous.

[BORO]

you would use the full phantom torch in the first month. However it has a lot to do with how much you work. I know blowers years in , but they only work a few days a month.

Your spoons will be of the quality to sell in a few weeks. (if you have any type of brain on your shoulders. ) Boro is stiff. its easy to stop the glass when it looks right. Soft glass is like forming 2 part epoxy. really hard to hit the right heat vs. boro. (assuming your torch will melt the boro )

Selling them, thats a different issue. If your glass that is "aceptable" has a place to be sold, your way way ahead. It took me much longer to find the regular sales , not as much time to learn the craft. When you have a case of pipes , and no money for gas , your stuck.

I tell most newer peeps.... the mid range plus is big , but still small. Its hot , but good on gas. Its the best bang for your buck. Like a smaller hotter red max. Best of all worlds... will work with concentration machines too.

If you could make stuff on a hot head , w/ soft glass... your 10 steps ahead of the others just starting. If you will stick to spoons and small stuff .. the lynx is fine. Its hot hot .. but narrow. ON A SMALL TORCH , THE BIGGEST BUBBLE , AND BIGGEST MARBLE SIZE ARE LIMITED, THATS IT. That's the real deal with torch size. Any oxy propane torch will build a full size rig, with the right kiln space. You can do it all on a one stage small torch. It just takes longer. So do you buy a big torch? work faster, and eat more gas.... you may make more product in a given time on a bigger torch. However over head for supply will be more. .... Or do you go small torch. limit your size, and speed... but save gas and glass? A big torch will go small , a small torch will not go big.

gtt's sell used for close to retail. You would get your money back when you switch. A chetta and a hand torch seems to work well. the hand torch covers your really small flames for detail.... the chetta does the rest. I would take a chetta and hand torch over a lynx. You will really want that top end heat in no time if you take this serious. If you have axis to some studios kiln... you can batch annel glass later in their kiln. If you can keep it in one piece long enough to make it to the kiln later.

[BORO]

I spent a 1000$ on my first set up.

A 500$ kiln. like the aim 96j.

A "mini cc" torch. The mini cc is wider than a lynx but not as concentrated a heat. I had axis to a lynx, but did not like it as much. It made hot spots , and was narrow.^user error on my part. Had I know how to operate it it may have been totally different? A lynx will go bigger than all the other similar size torches.

Some cheap eye glasses and tools. A few colors , a few clear sizes. A silver coin. Regulators , hoses, flash backs ,clamps , fire extinguisher. A hood built from wood. and a fan from lowes. The other big expense was the gas lease. Unless some one with good credit has you covered. It may have been 1200$ total. That set up paid my bills for 2 years. bubblers , spoons , all that stuff.

Did I crave a bigger torch in the first few weeks.. totally.

[snoopdog6502]

For sure talk to and keep in touch with other lamp workers for items they have to spare or outgrown.

For example a good old Guy I know called today and asked me If I want to buy 2 K tanks $50 each FULL! Hell yea! I buy both of them tomorrow. I need them for a homefil anyway.
Im going to see if I can talk him out of his Lynx as he has a new Phantom. Or he may loan it to me to try. We horse trade stuff too.
He is going to bring me a couple short rods of quartz for holding silver and gold for fuming.

All the little things add up. I bought a lot of new stuff because I was impatient and paid more.

[Bugzy1972]

I was in your boat several years ago and found a great deal on a Beth P2MD and still use it today. However I do suggest the Nortel Redmax to Beginners looking to make the step to a home studio. Keep and eye on the glassifides here and on your local craigslist. I picked up a used redmax a few years back off craigslist for $150. Buy used when you can, then upgrade when you start generating a profit from your hobby

[Nomad]

The beth would use a lot of oxygen. I would suggest a national 6-b with tips 2,3,5, 12 hole. Maybe even a cheap oxy con?
If you need something more like a redmax I would suggest the midrange plus with the minor top fire also. I would just get a bethlehem bravo myself though.

[Super Phunk]

I would say spend all your money on the phantom and worry about everything else after that.

[hashmasta-kut]

although i have a phantom and a kobuki, i don't agree. if you only have money for a lynx and a kiln do that, then when you have more extra funds, sell the lynx for what you paid for it, assuming you use it properly then it keeps its value, and then upgrade to a bigger torch of the size you think you will need.

[snoopdog6502]

Torch,kiln,oxygen,hoses and regulators,eye-wear and ventilation will eat some money up.

Iv had a torch for 4-1/2 months so far, spent $2,000 and have a sweet complete setup, well all but my torch is too small.
I realy want that 2 stage torch with an outer fire. Phantom or bigger.

Its a real kick in the ass shopping for gear. I wish you luck and hope you have as much fun as I did.
Like Christmas every time I get a package. :D

[Nomad]

I am thinking a Bethlehem Champion next. I hear it is that size. Right now I am using a Bravo.

[CaptainKeef]

I started on a phantom and the best advice I can give you if you choose to go that route is get on liquid oxygen and get it delivered. Plenty of people use tanked but personally I don't think I would have been able to keep going with airgas raping me for $40 a tank I would burn through in 15 hours. Oxygen is going to be your biggest headache.... Try to find a smaller local welding supply shop and odds are they will treat you a lot better than the big companies (at least that has been the case in my experience). If you get a smaller torch I would suggest researching oxygen concentrators. Homefill systems would be much cheaper in the long run but a bigger investment up front and there is always the possibility it could break. Also don't slack on ventilation double your budget for that.. Just my 2 cents


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[CaptainKeef]

Also a semi open studio is going to not work well. What happens when it rains and your new kiln gets soaked? Security? Extreme temps? Wind? At least try to figure out some sort of shed with 4 walls and a roof.


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[yinzer]

i definitely wouldn't skip a kiln to buy a nicer torch. when it comes time to actually make sales you are going to have an easier time making money to upgrade your torch with properly annealed product, than you will trying to come up with money for a kiln, with a bunch of questionably stable product. 9 years in and im on a redmax with a premix top. its not my favorite, but it suffices. i can rage the shit out of it and go pretty big. i used to have a phantom. i dont think i would trade my redmax for any less than a mirage. when i turn that ridiculous, radiant heat blaster on, i can get hotter quicker than i could on a phantom. i might lose a little arm hair, but i don't have much of that anyways. its also nice to be able to switch from surface mix to premix and vice versa. if i need a little bitty baby flame, i use my mini torch anyways. i definitely love gtts, and think they are a great investment. but i would take a redmax, a national, or a lynx and a kiln over a phantom and no kiln any day.

as for nationals, they are super cheap. they get the job done, and they make a great hand torch when you move on.

i started on a Bethlehem barracuda, which i guess they don't make anymore? it was nice, but didn't push it when i needed it to. it was nice on the colors and fuming, though. not sure what the equivalent would be now.

i also started on my back porch. it didnt take long for me to move inside. there are too many variables for it to work out long term. i would suggest puuting your kiln on a cart that can be wheeled inside, and moving inside as soon as you can.

[Greymatter Glass]

Indoors. Period. No debate.

Make your bench as large as practical, a 9x5 bench is awesome, you will find a use for the space, and you can easily put 2 people on it if/when you need to.

ventilation - don't skimp on it, if you can, plan your shop around it. It is normally the largest single expense in a quality shop - yes, even more than most torches and kilns

Kiln: as important, maybe MORE important than your torch, is a quality kiln. A small Paragon Caldera or Aim 89bd kiln is ok, but it will hold you back more than ANY torch ever will. A digital kiln with a guillotine (or otherwise full height, like a Bluebird XL) door is pretty much basic necessity. A quality kiln will last a life time with proper care, it's worth it to invest in one early. At my store I sell 3 kilns under $1500 (one under $1000) that are _GREAT_ kilns and will last a long time before they're what's holding you back: The Paragon Bluebird XL, and the Paragon F120 and F130. They're great kilns, lots of room that is easy to access and they have a small enough footprint that they fit well on even a fairly small bench.

Lighting. I've seen too many people that "cheat" looking over the top of their glasses or spend INSANE amounts of money on split lens glasses and quickly get eye strain looking up and down all the time. I love Mike, he makes the best glasses, but I do not endorse split lens glasses for most people - get a LOT of light on your bench and use full coverage glasses. If you can't see your tools and glass don't cheat looking over the top - add more light. I like the basic track light set ups at Home Depot and Lowes with 4 60W equivlenet (or better) Compact Florescent bulbs, it's a LOT of light, but you can still easily see your flame, and no need to peek constantly to find stuff on the bench.

Music - Invest in a decent Bluetooth speaker or a small bookshelf style stereo and dance with your glass damnit.

If your shop isn't attached to your house (or even if it is) a small dorm fridge, microwave, and coffee pot is awesome, as is a chilled water dispenser of some sort (plumbed in or 5 gallon bottles) Keep some drinks and lunch cool so you don't have to leave your shop to get a drink... seriously the time you save will pay for it within a year.


Budgeting for a studio is tough. For the basic tools and equipment once you have a place to work I usually tell people to buget between $1500-3000 (depending on torch and kiln, mostly)... to build out a studio properly I would say $1000 minimum, probably closer to $2000 + $1000 per additional workstation (that doesn't include torch/kiln/tools) that covers work surface, construction materials, lights, ventilation, and "comfort" .


On a budget I've done it, and seen it done, much cheaper... but it's always cheaper to do it once than twice, so consider it as an investment to do it right up front if you can.