Would you open a store ?

[pieceofmind]

Would you open a small store front glass shop if you had the opportunity ? I have a small space around 600 sqf with a nice window on a busy street for a steal of a deal. I have been thinking about renting it out for me and my partner. If you did open the shop would you carry the typical headshop bs. Would you carry any other of the big name production lines out there. Or would you make and sell all your own glass ?

[pieceofmind]

No opinions ?

[istandalone24/7]

depends on where you are (location wise, and skills wise), how much the rent is, how much competition is in your locale etc.
there is no right or wrong answer. if the rent/utilities were affordable, and there isn't already a dozen head shops in town, and you guys can make pretty much all your stock then yes you'd be in good shape and if it was me, i'd do it.

[Nomad]

Forget that! How do you blow glass and handle retail sales?


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[Nomad]

It's greedy.....


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[istandalone24/7]

Nomad, read before you comment. he and his partner. that's two....one for the torch one for the cash register.

[istandalone24/7]

It's greedy.....


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ok wtf are you even talking about now?
i think i've figured out who funksizzle really is......

[Nomad]

I have tried it before. I like the partnership I have with retailers as is. Wanting more money is not worth it. My opinion that's all.


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[istandalone24/7]

yeah, but if his rent is cheap, and has the skills to make everything he stocks, it could very well be a great thing.

[Nomad]

Cheap studio space is awesome! But retail is hard work and risky. Plus it is a headache. I only do retail arts and crafts shows once in a wile. Taxes such and you can always sell stuff out of your studio.


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[Nomad]

But if you own the store you have artistic freed. But you need a market for it. I don't see Darby opening a store. Just the most awesome studio.


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[Nomad]

Freedom is what meant.


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[Cottontail]

Retail isnt a headache if you can balance it out it works fantastically. I cant justify selling $9.00 bubblers to wholesalers, my time is worth more than that in the big picture. Theres no greed involved in wanting to run your own store, typically any glass shop owner I know of also carries a fair amount of other brands/artists work. I dont think small business, the American dream and greed have anything in common.

However if you're okay with doing wholesale work and pumping out production, thats what you should be doing. Everyone should do what works best for them.

Getting back to the original post.. Whats your locale and demographic like? Do you have competition? Can you afford the overhead? For me personally, and the average glass collector I'd think a shop with a studio space would be much higher on my list of places to visit than Joe Schmoes wholesale prodo emporium. You really need to look at a lot of factors before making that move and diversify your store as much as possible.

[Nomad]

Who sells $9 bubbs? Not me!


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[Nomad]

I guess I am no schmoe?


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[Nomad]

I can retail small bubbs for $35 plus shipping without a store or anything.


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[pieceofmind]

I have 2 kids and no time to travel around with cases full of glass trying to sell them to tightwads who rather buy china prodo. I I figured if I open my own shop then I can make and retail my own work while building a steady client base and making some cool friends. My studio space would be my store. Pretty much so people can watch stuff being made etc. We make neon signs and accessories for street bikes also so we are also looking to display that. I think it is a little arrogant to say that it is greedy to open a store. I would be selling other us made only glass as well which would put money in other artists pockets. Would have bench space for rent and display space for artist to sell stuff made in house.

[Nomad]

Sounds like a romantic idea. I am going to pass on it. I was just given the opportunity also. But I think a really nice studio is all I need.


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[Nomad]

My brother was going to do the sales also. But I can outsell these guys any day.


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[pieceofmind]

No headshops in 30 miles. Small college town. 600 sqf storefront with all utils paid for 400 month. Would have 3-4 bench spaces and display cases in front.

I just see the value in having a store where people can see stuff being made. It's the wow factor. It would make your work stand out. The customer would know it came from me. When you sell pipes to headshops. Do you think the idiot behind the counter is giving the care to the glass that you are ? Do you think he could tell the customer the exact process of his piece of even the colors used. I think all of that would make a big difference at the end of the day.

[mattholimeau]

istandalone has a bunch of good questions: location, competition, rent, etc.

However, there is clearly a right and wrong answer: the right answer will be economically successful, and the wrong answer is a store that won't last long.

If I were to do something like this - and, well, full disclosure is that I'm not going to do anything like this, as I've never owned a business or anything of that nature, I'm a programmer by day (and am waiting for my code to compile as I write this, honest! [https://xkcd.com/303/]) - but, anyway, if I were to do something like this, I'd probably try to follow the model I've seen of a front shop as a jewelry boutique and have an 18+ back room with pipes.

I'm sure I wouldn't be able to stock a whole store with glass I've made - but I'm a hobbyist, I'm happy to simply have a full case of pendants (~30 of em) at any one time... but if I were to buy a shop and start doing glass full time, I'd definitely want to have as much glass in the store as possible be of my own making. And then, of course, that's much easier said than done - as it'll all also completely depend on what sells. I don't do lathe work or any large water pipes (can't say the "b" word when talking about retail shops!) - and if those are all that sells, well, then it is what it is.

While I strongly disagree with Nomad's remarks concerning greed not being worth it (there's a huge difference between working harder and smarter to get more money versus cutting corners and screwing people over to get more money... and moreover, we're operating in a capitalist society, making more money is intended to be a primary motivator for innovation, and that's a good thing... and finally, you made $0 when you were born, in fact arguably you were significantly negative in the math of money making as an infant, so, if making more money is inherently greedy and bad, and morally wrong, so nobody ever made more money, the economy would cease to exist) - I would definitely agree with his sentiment that retail is a freakin pain in the ass. If you and your partner are both lampworkers and artists, and are primarily looking for a way to expand your lampworking opportunities, then maybe this isn't a great idea. To do something like this, you'd really need to have a passion for building a retail business. Making glass and selling it are completely different skill sets.

(edited to fix typo: changed "in" to "is")

[MUPH]

Sounds like a romantic idea. I am going to pass on it.

He didn't offer you anything

[Nomad]

I don't think they are idiots. 600 square feet is kind of small. But $400 is not bad but I am not paying that much. I get $10 a I/O chillum who


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[pieceofmind]

When you sell a pipe to a store to be resold your losing $$ You could be selling all your own stuff retail and it wouldn't get lost on a shelf of other people's work.

[Nomad]

He didn't offer you anything

My father offered to buye a storefront on Colorado.


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[Nomad]

To explain where I coming from.


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[Nomad]

Sorry about the spelling. iPhone?


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[BORO]

The bike/ neon thing alone may float a store front.

Pipes will be a plus. Sounds like it could work to me.

600 sq feet. 4 stations? Plus counter/register space .....A tight squeez if you have anything on display at the same time.

All the neon equipment too? I don't know the proper name for the electric test table, vacuum , gasses, ect ect. I do know how much is required tho.

"10#s in a 5# bag." As they say.

[gomilobster]

If you are already paying for any rental space to work out of (I s'pose most people are not) it seems like a pretty nice deal. I mean if the space would meet all your electrical requirements, and you can get natural gas pumped in, or find a way to get your propane in to the torches in a way which is up to code etc, it could be a nice thing. I would certainly keep in mind the amount of time you will not be blowing glass in dealing with setting up, customizing and getting things running on an official level. You might need to consider hiring more employees etc. If you have no experience in this I wouldn't say not to try, but obviously it is no light undertaking. Much luck, I would love to get to work in an actual smoke shop where my stuff is being sold on the regular.

[istandalone24/7]

Sounds like a romantic idea. I am going to pass on it. I was just given the opportunity also. But I think a really nice studio is all I need.


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really? a nice studio will make your work nicer? didn't you like just get done building that shed studio?

[mattholimeau]

When you sell a pipe to a store to be resold your losing $$ You could be selling all your own stuff retail and it wouldn't get lost on a shelf of other people's work.

pieceofmind, that's not really true at all, and in my opinion really isn't a healthy way to look at it. You're not losing money, you're gaining whatever you sell things to the shop for - certainly less than if you sold everything retail, but it's not a loss of money. That sort of mindset may lead you to be dangerously underestimating the value added by the store.... and then subsequently underestimating the amount of work it takes to keep a shop running.

[Cottontail]

I can retail small bubbs for $35 plus shipping without a store or anything.


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I apologize if that came off harsh, I wasnt intending it to, just some experience in other forms of sales outside the glass world. I dont know your wholesale pricing, I was just throwing random figures out as examples. I think you, and anyone should do what is profitable for them in the long term. One thing works well for person A, another for person B, its about finding that personal balance where you're happy.



A very real option for a combo store is a vape section, make your own juices sell some RDAs, make the entire place an experience for smokers, vapers, and collectors alike. Its cool to be able to hang out and browse while vaping. Legal in almost all places too. The neon is a good way to keep outside sales going, but will your neon customers look down at your drug pipe stop n shop? Hopefully not, hopefully that won't harm any business. This again is all about balance.

Im just spitballing here though, everything works different for everyone.

[Nomad]

The first guy I learned from owns a gallery and studio now. He just does sales now. He carves molds for his casting studio once in a wile. He hires people to pour into the molds for hardly anything. If that means anything? He is all about being a salesman now.


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[Nomad]

Yeah neon is a separate business. I sell jewelry also but it is kind of a front for my glass pipes. Not that many people know about the pipes. I kept the same clients for years.


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[Nomad]

really? a nice studio will make your work nicer? didn't you like just get done building that shed studio?

The house is for sale. When it sells I starting a bigger studio. I will have some money to invest. But that will be it. When my parents die I might be able to invest again but most likely will be my retirement. With part time work in glass.


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[Nomad]

My parents planned it all out for me already. I get a trust fund and work as an artist. My sister and brother get a lump sum. A trust ensures I don't loose my benefits also. Medical expenses add up.


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[MUPH]

My parents planned it all out for me already. I get a trust fund and work as an artist

The famous last words..

[BORO]

Trustafarian?!

Nomad,my resect Level just dropped a rung. (if that's even possible )

Hit me with a infraction if you must... I still claim "wtf"

[humboldt mafia]

Would you open a small store front glass shop if you had the opportunity ? I have a small space around 600 sqf with a nice window on a busy street for a steal of a deal. I have been thinking about renting it out for me and my partner. If you did open the shop would you carry the typical headshop bs. Would you carry any other of the big name production lines out there. Or would you make and sell all your own glass ?

would u :

sell it to the person with the most money when you got sick ?

pass it on to a family member with no intent of running it correctly ?

sell it and leave it vacant ?

retire instead of working yourself to death ?

stop spending money to make money after you retire ?

get mad at your kids or partner for not being able to copy you or not wanting to ?

kill yourself with the money ?

buy a family with the money ?

kill your family with the money ?

not be able to make money ? lol.

[CaptainKeef]

I have thought seriously about this a good bit. There is only one headshop within an hour drive of my hometown (around 100k people but a lot more with the surrounding counties) they sell all import crap for a huge markup. What pisses me off is they advertise in big letters on there sign "Come see our large selection of glass from local glassblowers". But 100% of their glass is import and they tell people it's from local artist. Grrrr. If I opened up a small storefront and advertised 100% american glass I could crush them. I think it prolly comes down to do you want to be a store owner or a glassblower?.... Obviously opening a store is gonna be expensive with employees, rent and other stuff that adds up quick (advertising, signage, business license, insurance, displays, phone line, Internet , ect ect) for the store to be successful you are gonna need to be there making sure everything is going smooth and nobody is stealing you blind (gonna be hard to find time to blow glass and run a store). I think what would prolly happen if I opened one is I would find out it's easier just to buy other people's stuff and sell it than make it myself and wouldn't blow much glass anymore. I supposed if you did it right it you could juggle the two but you would need some damn good help.


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[CaptainKeef]

If I had the money I would do it


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[CaptainKeef]

What Nomad said about it being "greedy" is absurd


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[Wilbur]

My parents planned it all out for me already. I get a trust fund and work as an artist. My sister and brother get a lump sum. A trust ensures I don't loose my benefits also. Medical expenses add up.


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Sweet score dude. I hope they structured child support payments to come directly out of that.

As for the store front- do it. You can rarely find industrial space to work out of that cheap, so I'd view the retail as purely icing on the cake. Set up one station in a place so that you can be working and still Interact with people if they come in.

But make sure you'll actually be able to blow glass in the building before signing ie: land lords are down, insurance will work out, you have the dough to do whatever it takes to have the fire Marshall appeased etc.

[istandalone24/7]

My parents planned it all out for me already. I get a trust fund and work as an artist. My sister and brother get a lump sum. A trust ensures I don't loose my benefits also. Medical expenses add up.


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so you do get a free ride. must be nice is all i'm saying.
i'd love to live the dream....of making wrap and rakes and not paying one iota of my bills myself.

[istandalone24/7]

so you are a confirmed trustafarian (hey we can't help what we were born into...and honestly most of us are jealous i'd imagine) but any amt of "street cred" you had by being a "self made man" is out the window. sorry. you should have kept that info to youself.

[jr23]

Ah that's not nomads style. Back to storefront. Above someone said make sure you can blow glass in building. I also say make sure you still have time. If you still want to work.

[Nomad]

I am sorry I got too personal on this one. I wish I was a trustafarian. My sister went to school with them at uvm. I am just an upper middle class white boy. Who is half Jewish.


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[Nomad]

Traditionally artists are not poor. Especially in France. They all lived off there families wealth.


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[Nomad]

No more child support in 7 years. I don't earn enough for me to pay for college. If I had a relationship with her family might. But at the moment no.


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[Nomad]

Inheritance doesn't count in divorce.


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[istandalone24/7]

if you have a trust fund....you are. it is what it is.

like i said most people are probably jealous, that includes me. yes there is something to be said about being self made. there's also something to be said for not doing a damn thing for your money (even if it is only "upper middle class").
don't deny it, embrace it.

[Nomad]

It's when my parents pass away. Not now! 10 years from now. It's my grandparents money.


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[Nomad]

Grandpa invented machines that packaged products on one side and the other invested in stocks.


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[Nomad]

Both made millions.


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[Nomad]

You guys would hate my customers. They have more than I do.


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[mellofello]

istandalone24/7 - Nomad is/ has been pretty open before about the fact that he gets support from his family. I don't have issue with that but anyone taking business advice from him should take that in to account when taking advice from him. What he calls greedy is actually just people trying to make an actual living that will support them and their familys.

[pieceofmind]

Nomad. Think you could limit your posts to just one when you have a opinion ?You don't have to break it down into twelve posts. Just use punctuation and we will be able to break it up ourselves. Or is that just to up your post count on the forum ?


Wilbur. the plan would be to work in a space where I could still deal with customers when they walk in. I don't think would run into time issues. There would always be someone on the torch and someone at the counter. I would probably carry one or two cases of fair priced name brand stuff like zob or grav labs. And the rest of the stuff would be made in house or at the least from other local and usa artist's.

[pieceofmind]

You have a trustfund ? But I'm greedy cause I want to open a store to make a few bucks to support my family. Get bent douchebag.

[istandalone24/7]

must be nice. i'm sure if my parents were in the position to do the same for me, they would. as it turns out i'll end up keeping my day job and melting glass on the side, as my mother is likely taking an early retirement and we need the money. yes i moved back in with them nearly 10 years ago, but i pay $600 a month in rent, i pay my own utilities (my portion of the electric, oil, wood pellets etc) and do a lot of my own food shopping (due to them having restricted diets). a lot of people seem to think that living with the 'rents is a free ride. not even close.

[Nomad]

Sorry. I'm on vacation and I am on my new iPhone. The autocorrect is hard to use.

I pay rent also to parents.


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[Nomad]

You have a trustfund ? But I'm greedy cause I want to open a store to make a few bucks to support my family. Get bent douchebag.

I am sorry. I have been accused of being greedy also. I have said enough.


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[PyroChixRock]

If it's going to come down to calling names then we have to get the ban stick out. We'd rather blow glass so keep it chill people.

Train wreck thread closed.