Did ABR rip off mike close and or other artists?

[wesleypipes]

I had thought about getting the bump marble mold from ABR for a $150. Then I was in West Count glass and saw Mike Close's mold for $120 and picked it up. I then saw a thread on Facebook about how, according to Mike, ABR stole his design after carrying his product, started making it in china a cut him out, and are charging their customers $30 more than the original.

I have had my own positive and negative experiences with ABR however after hearing this I stopped doing any business with them.

Getting cheep stuff from china seems to be the norm and I understand it, however, taking someones design like that seems particularity malicious.

Maybe there is more to the sorry that I don't know and if I am wrong I would be happy to hear it.

[Yeef]

i'm not sure how a thread like this sits vis a vis defamation. just sayin. i would imagine if mike close had his (wildly successful) design stolen by a company he'd be the one to ask about it.

[330G]

i heard about this shit also. Mountain Glass Carries the real Mike Close molds. Mike does not do business with ABR any longer and they still sell the design (Mike said that himself). So yes the sure as shit did rip his mold design off so they could keep pushing forward to make that almighty $$. Sure as hell seems the problems with Abr are more than abundant.

[BORO]

^ I have Been doing this too...

Love illuminati ISO.

Now you see me , now you don't.



I don't think u.v. Glass will ever be out. Its like glow glass, its the buyer who pays. They love that stuff. What other artists think is played out doesn't matter.



You can get an amazing sparkle brown. Its one part moss/ or any super sparkle green, and 5 or 6 parts import amber brown... That's the color I have been using for my u.v
overlay core.... This brown (the fin)

[istandalone24/7]

actually if a (trusted) vendor does something like this, drama or not, we (the customers) deserve to know.

[Aymie]

I am in favor of this being discussed here as well, as long as the people who participate actually have some valid information that comes first hand.

[Nomad]

A lot of people make graphite molds.

[istandalone24/7]

yeah, and business peoples that actually have scruples will not blatantly copy someone else's design, be it "copywrited" or "trademarked" or whatever. it's just wrong.

i for one will pay the $25 or $30 more to get one that i know Mike Close made. simple as that.

[istandalone24/7]

i do believe mike close is a member? maybe he can or will chime in?

direct from "the horses mouth", so to speak.

[wesleypipes]

Sure maybe its not my place to start this discussion. It seemed clear to me there was some shady business but I still posed it as a question. If I had learned of it sooner I would have would have given less business to ABR and I thought others might be interested.

There seems to be a double standard among glass blowers that expect shop owners and customers to be informed consumers that only buy American glass, yet when it comes to spending their dollars its another story.

Suzuki I respect you opinion and you certainly aren't obligated to read or participate in threads you think are lame. However as a mater of courtesy to those who are interested please don't make irrelevant posts. I thought thread jacking was looked down on and as staff I am surprised.

[pacosaki]

Hi. I am Mike Close replying to this thread. I have been a member here for a number of years and have only had positive experience here. I learned so much here when I was a noob. I am not about negative or inflamitory posts! But I wanted to respond to this one. Thank you all for this place.
Now here's the story of me and ABR...
I developed this mold geometry in 2005/2006. I have my original post on glass artists.org from back then. ABR was selling it for me as a distributor. They didn't sell many at that time. They bought from me until 2009. I didn't really sell any molds in 2010/2011 but saw a resurgence in sales after a post on facebook and they took off. Mountain glass, ARTCO, and West County glass sell them for me now. Josh Mazett also sells them at his classes. Glasscraft sold them at the Freddy Faeron class recently.
ABR sells a poor copy of the mold. The layout is the same, but it looks like, from pics of their copy I have seen, the sizes are off and the bumps don't look all that great. Also, there is no telling what grade of graphite they are using. They still have the pic of my original mold on their site.
So you ask why do I let this go on? What about trademark, copyright, patent? Yeah...well, there is no patent, or trademark. I don't have the funds to prosecute the violation, and there is not enough $$ in the mold market to justify the patent. So I rely on your loyalty and the fact that this is a very expensive mold to produce, so if I can keep the cost down, it's gonna be pretty hard for people to copy these and make any money at it. When I see someone post a pic of the copy, I comment on it. I have nothing to do with ABR. I have not asked them to remove the pic of my mold as the pic to pics of the mold are all over the Internet (thank you all! ) and they can snag one from anyplace. But if you look at the pic of what they are advertising and what you ultimately get, they are different. So that's the story from my side.
Thanks again for all the kind words and support for my product.
Marble On!

[Ray]

Thank you Mike for weighing in.

I'm glad to say I bought mine from a place that sell's yours.
I specifically wanted your's, and am glad to know that it is.
Maybe you could ask places that sell your's to credit it as yours.

[snoopdog6502]

Mike is a class act in all of this. all the more reason to support him.

[330G]

I mean if thats not the definition of ripping off someones design i dont know what is. Very Shady.

Ill buy one from mountain glass in the future so i know i get the real deal.

[VinE]

The knockoff pinfrogs (that are not made for glasswork, and contain harmful alloys and metals) started showing up shortly after I promoted and shared my tool design on here and glassartist.org No real way to fight against big corporations that have WAY more $$ and time to deal with b.s. than I do. This is textbook. Cutthroat business,practiced by a corporation trying to impose a monopoly on marginalized artists who don't have the ability, imputus or willpower to band together to fight for what's right.

[VinE]

Def. Going to support mike and pick up one of those molds from artco or mountain glass this week.

[PyroChixRock]

Or maybe Mike direct? Do you sell direct, Mike? You are welcome to sling them here, we will gladly set you up with a vendor badge/access.

[themoch]

i got like 2 lbs of illuminati, better go put that shit on everything

[oG Glocc Coma]

Mike Close mold is my next purchase! Can't wait to get one awesome design Mike... Blew my mind these have been around since 2006, I just recently seen them about a year ago or so!

[daveabr]

I will have to search back into the memory bank on this one. But, as I remember it, Mike, you had decided to quit producing the molds. Ross and I several times tried to order more from you, and were happy dealing with you. When there was no longer a source for a product that our customers wanted, we had some made. However, our molds are made here in America, with American graphite, by a well respected tool maker for many years in the industry, Jerry at Retro Glass Tools. They are not crappy China knock offs, or low quality graphite.

I was never made aware of you having any issue with this, as you had decided to stop making them and never came at us to say we shouldn't. If you were into producing the molds again, I don't remember every being contacted by you. Even though Jerry is a respected tool maker, and making them in America, we would be happy to carry yours again, and credit your name. I just remember you going overseas or something, and that was last we heard of you. Please, by all means, let us know, and we can change the situation no problem Mike.