when to stop?

**dplaza** · 05-21-2017, 08:36 PM

anybody have any rule of thumb or guidelines for knowing when to cut your losses and trash a piece? i spent a ton of time on a piece over the last week and just had to trash it. i had plenty of opportunities to give up when things went to hell and im kinda wishing i had.

**hashmasta-kut** · 05-21-2017, 08:45 PM

there is no rule of thumb. I typically try more than I should I think, but I have saved things that you wouldn't believe. Its probably prudent to try and figure out how long a remake takes compared to how long you spend on attempting to save problems.

**CheeseNip** · 05-22-2017, 11:17 AM

Hard to say, as that is different for every artist. I usually just go until I get outside of what I find acceptable in terms of quality. Even if I can make it a sellable piece, if it isn't as nice as I think it should be, it usually goes in the "save for later" spot for the next year until I decide I don't want to finish it, or I get t the point where I can do it nicer and just remake it. lol

**Jackass Glass** · 05-22-2017, 11:40 AM

Originally Posted by dplaza

anybody have any rule of thumb or guidelines for knowing when to cut your losses and trash a piece? i spent a ton of time on a piece over the last week and just had to trash it. i had plenty of opportunities to give up when things went to hell and im kinda wishing i had.

welp.... since im living in the - lots of work no reward booth with you... ill chime in.

honestly.. since im just starting out and most of my stuff isnt flawless by any means. i use the F ups to try new techs.

like if i have a piece that i can heal... i actually put more work into it. by say. enclamo a new section. or wig something. or bend something. figure its not going to work well anyway. might as well do it on a janker anyway

**dplaza** · 05-22-2017, 04:24 PM

Yah originally it was a beaker bottom with a color section on the base and I had a matching section for the join to the tube... but I effed up connecting them.

So then I made the can part into a giant donut with a color section on one side... but messed up attaching a tube to that.

So I flattened part of the donut and made that the base. Then the thing started to crack like hell.
Flattened donut is probably not a shape the glass likes very much in hindsight, also It was all thick and creasing on itself... I fought too hard trying to save it, the thing was doomed. Should a known better oh well, guess I gotta try again lol.

**labrie** · 05-23-2017, 08:38 AM

I learn more from my mistakes, just wish I remembered all that I learned.

**hashmasta-kut** · 05-23-2017, 08:58 AM

The main thing you learn I find is how much can be saved flawlessly. Sometimes it doesnt go so well, but other times sections of linework artwork for example, can suffer a hellacious crack fiesta, and still meld back together virtually undetectable.

For another example, say you have a large piece with a clear section all bridged up to join somewhere and shit goes south, you can actually add clear into area as needed to heal problems, and then rework it into a fresh section.

**snoopdog6502** · 05-23-2017, 11:57 AM

Iv tossed cracked up jank aside for a year or more, got it hot as hell and reworked it into some of my better work.

Im not very good anyway but when reworked I blew all the welds out like they were supposed to be so you could not even see the weld anymore, just a smooth transition.

**BORO** · 05-23-2017, 01:01 PM

Big beaker bottoms are one of the easiest shapes to screw up imo.

for me, usually I'm trying to move too much glass with too little heat? It always introduces stress on the lower walls and it will bite back in a dramatic fashion. For that reason I always press my beaker's flat spot last. I always try to use a big soft heat and let that shape relax with out distorting. Usually it's the bottom 2 inches or so.

Maybe I just like a beaker shape that is prone to fail?

I can totally relate to the o.p.

**Bielan** · 05-25-2017, 06:06 AM

Like everything it's a process of learning. I have opposite problem. I'm giving up too fast and then I regret casue if I would work ofer a piece some more it would be sellable.

**PyroChixRock** · 05-25-2017, 10:44 AM

You will learn more from trying to fix mistakes than anything else. Even if you don't succeed remember you have just invested into your skill level.

**dustyg** · 05-25-2017, 10:46 AM

I watched this video of Patrick Lee the other day, and I learned a little from his technique when it went right, but was more impressed with how he fixed the little things that went wrong.

**doosight** · 05-30-2017, 08:37 PM

Don't trash anything and don't work when you are frustrated. If you badly eff something up, stick it in the kiln and think about what you are going to do with it later. If you cant come up with anything, save it for when you are more experienced and confident working with it. If i was you i would have just torn the beaker off of the color section and re-used it for another project. My two cents

**dplaza** · 05-31-2017, 04:35 AM

yah thats what i did essentially. just my subsequent attempts ended in disaster as well.

i think the whole reason the can to the neck seal didn't work out was i stretched the can a little bit to get a smoother shape and that caused a thin band of glass just below where the connection point was going to be. the more heat i tried to add just made each side want to gather onto themselves instead of flowing to the thin area.

in the wake of the aftermath the bottom of the beaker was super wide compared to how much glass it had left. if i could have somehow pulled off welding a new tube it might have made a nice decanter, or a piece that looked like a giant perfume bottle. but it was supposed to be for my friend and he wanted the mouth tube to be at least 38mm.

i learned a lot from that battle though, i think if anything i only really regret the last 3 or 4 hours i put into it, i should have cut my losses when i realized the glass was getting really overworked. like cheesenip said it was beyond what could be acceptable quality.

what i learned is :
a. that shit was too heavy for me to spin well (need to get rollers)
b. make sure that the connection point and heat affected areas are all uniform thickness before connecting
c. the color sections i made a long time ago and were really uneven for what i was trying to do.
d. i kinda stink at spinning 16mm, my muscle memory is best for 12mm on both sides or one side with a 7mm punty.

it was the largest can i've ever gathered up easily. i think maybe i tried to go a little too big too fast.

i appreciate all the advice. i torch alone all the time, learned mostly everything on this site. so when i try new stuff sometimes i feel like im wandering around in the dark running into walls haha.

**Royer** · 06-01-2017, 01:25 AM

Originally Posted by dplaza

i appreciate all the advice. i torch alone all the time, learned mostly everything on this site. so when i try new stuff sometimes i feel like im wandering around in the dark running into walls haha.

It pays to have a shopmate. Our expenses are split 50/50 and we share any glass knowledge we come across or use our combined brains to figure out techniques which is always a fun talk if anything.
I don't know if you have an instagram but consider using it. Great artists are always live streaming, so much to learn for only the cost of a phone and monthly data lol

**Zed** · 06-01-2017, 05:01 AM

When the effort, time or cost of repair exceeds 50% of the effort, time or cost of starting over. Once something goes beyond a tipping point of fucked its never going to be right again. Save what you can easily save for the next piece and bail with a eye on anything easily recycled into beads or jars or something.