Lookin' good, Bones

**PyroChixRock** · 08-05-2014, 07:57 PM

You're trying to get more hue to your fuming. Hmm...that's kinda a vague question. I'll take a swing.

Adding gold to the mix will help. As for the rest it's a lot of trial and error.

Fume your silver onto cold glass (when possible) to see it show up more, which will help you not to overfume. Then when you heat it, it will turn to a nice yellow and not be overwhelming. Too much silver turns to white and smeary grey. If you're getting that, use less.

A lot less.

Fume gold onto hot glass and try not to hit it with the flame after before you get it encased in clear to get those reds in the pic above.

Mix them for greens and blues and pinks

**bowlpusher** · 08-05-2014, 08:23 PM

Props to Mer, Bob Snodgras, Yvone Padilla, Adam G, Alex Vicknair, Ben Birney, Jesse Knott, Kenan Tiemeyer, Maka B, Eusheen Goines, Nate Miers, Freeman Corbin, Mark Lami, Jason Lee, Misled Youth, Shiny, Kevin Nail, Clinton Roman, Talon Jim O’Shea, CJ Freestone. These guys have either contributed to the conversation below or have helped me understand fume. They all work it so well, check out their works.

Jason Lee, “I’ve fumed with gold,silver,copper,platinum,and palladium.
Copper isn't great, but it's cheap and the only way you can get Red in a full rainbow of fume.

Get the purest metals you can...this makes the biggest difference.
.999fine ingot/coin silver and Canadian Maple Leaf gold coins.

The Canadian gold is to the highest standard of any coin in the world...electrolysis process, good stuff. the Canadian will improve your color range ALOT.
silver makes blue to purple in a thin layer,
gold makes deep orange in a similar layer,
...all the other colors are from the fade of combinations...

25% gold/75% silver - makes yellow
50/50% silver/gold - makes green,
75% silver/25% gold - makes shiny greenish blue,
...and all the rates in between.

These are all approximate references to the reflected colors, transmitted colors are a whole other field.
24K gold has silver in it to help it hold a shine...it is NOT pure.
Cheap silver has copper in it to harden it...it is NOT pure.

The broader spectrum of PURE metal will create the broadest range of colors with the most shine, dull pastel shades are not what you want. Sterling, 24K, .999, etc are all just branding terms to refer to different mixtures that work well. If the gold wasn't made by "Electrolysis", it isn't the purest you can get. .999 is the best silver available usually, but I’ve seen laboratory Silver Nitrate powder that worked phenomenally. Most coins have nickel or copper in them so they wont dent easily or loose their shine.

Demand the Good Shit! ALL coin shops have access to the Canadian Maple Leafs.
They are the world standard for purity.

24k is 99.7% pure with copper added for shine, durability, and dent resistance. "Proof" gold is 99.95% pure and is soft as shit. How to make your own -
"24-carat gold: Twenty-two parts gold (24 carat), 2 parts silver, and 1 part copper"

Canadian maple leafs are 99.99999% fine gold. I will add:
Pure metals don't stick quite as well to the glass...a little more sensitive to having the tube warmed properly; the impurities, while reducing spectrums, make them have stronger bonding abilities to the glass. For a while, I used to work exclusively with hand-panned river gold...no silver. The natural combination of metals and impurities made some nice milky opalescent shades that looked neat and were more "Organic" for the hippie fans. I also found that I could make a lot of variety by using different densities of fume.”

Anything can be done, just try to make the most of it.
Source: https://www.facebook.com/groups/453188471397229/files/

Fuming Tips

Turn your propane down and your oxygen up. Think about how you use the propane valve on your torch to adjust the oxidizing/reducing. Then imagine that you could do it to the inner and outer propane valve at the same time just by changing the propane pressure. For the Delta I have set it as high as 80 for the oxy and as low as 2.5 on the propane.

To use it heat up the end of a 6 mil. rod and pick up a very small clipping of it.
If the rod is room temp, touch it to the warm bubble before putting it in the flame. It allows the metal to heat so that it does not “jump.”

Be careful to minimize your exposure to the fumes. The fumes are toxic. Use good ventilation.

Start with light fuming and see what effects you get. Heavier fuming of silver creates whitish color.

You can layer silver and gold fuming and get lots of different interesting effects. Fume light silver first to help the gold bond with the glass, fume gold, and fume a very light silver.

Fuming in zones or regions will give transitions in color. Overlaying in zones will create a variety of colors. Try fuming the tip of the bubble silver and the back side of it gold. When fuming gold angle the piece away from you and only hit the rim. Notice how the fuming has three distinct colors. The gold, the silver with gold, and the silver on the tip.

Variables in Fuming
How many times the metal has been used
New Fume light blue, faint
Old Fume yellow, thick
Size of the metal
Temperature of the glass
Fume cold glass
Fume hot glass, see difference?

“One thing that makes a huge difference that few people realize is the temperature of your glass when you fume. For silver, I find it's easier to hit the metallic shiny blues with the glass almost cold when it's fumed. Grab a cold point- preheat half of it and fume it. Blow it up into a bubble and notice the different colors, it'll amaze you.”

Source: Jason Howard http://www.talkglass.com/forum/showt...232#post752232

Flame profile and atmosphere (flame chemistry)
Metal purity (alloy)

The size of the bubble and thickness will change the hue of the fume color. The layer of fume is thinned when you blow out the bubble after fuming. Light is diffracted differently by the density of metals that have condensed on the glass.

You can fume with panned gold. It is a little different and unique.
Jewelry shops buy it from miners that find it in rivers.

If you fume silver and use a really reducing flame when doing it you will get a thicker fume.

If you use a more neutral flame you will get less density and a much nicer color. Less can be more.

Every time you remove the heat from an area and reapply heat it will change the crystal growth levels, essentially striking the fume inside of the piece.

To layer fuming, fume then wash it with a large neutral to reducing flame. Lay a few lines or dots, change the flame atmosphere and condense. Lay more artwork between fuming. Start with a layer of wrap and rake and blend that section with dots into another set of artwork.

If you are getting the dark yellow brownish look you are using way too much silver.

An oxy rich flame will burn the silver off easily.

Robert Mickelsen “For silver, I use a long, rich flame that is almost all blue and red and very little green. Make sure there is lots of gas in the flame. For gold, I use a more balanced mix, leaner with more green, but still lots of blue so the flame is long and thin. The gold requires a lot more heat than the silver.”

Source: http://www.talkglass.com/forum/showt...124#post557124

Fume also is affected by the temp of the glass when the fume is applied.
You can burn fume off the inside of a tube with an oxidizing flame, let it cool, and expose it to a reducing flame. This will “strike” back the fume. If it was heavy enough it may turn black, purple or green.

Flame strike finished silver pieces like you would amber purple. Heat entire piece slowly in the back of the flame as to not raise the internal temp over 1200 C (which is right below a faint orange glow.) Let cool until it is almost cool enough to crack. Repeat heating step and hold at just below a glow for a few minutes. Let cool, repeat if necessary.

They type of glass you use to fume will pre determine results. Simax, very old pyrex and some batches of Kimax do not have crystal inhibitors in the batch glass which allows the silver crystals to grow in a different fashion with amazing results.

Gold
Gold loves oxy rich flames
22Kt wire gives good results too
Use only a little bit of gold. If you use it lightly you will get pink purple. If you lay it heavy you will get a gold mirror. The gold mirror on a piece may be undesirable.
Gold also burn's off easily in a propane rich/reducing flame.
Use a little piece of cobalt on the tip of a clear rod to pick up.
You can also use quartz.
Fume with gold on the bottom otherwise it will get sunk into the clear and disappear.
Where to buy gold
Coin stores
Mt Glass
http://www.generationsglass.com/?f

http://www.riogrande.com/Product/24K.../608122?Pos=10

MSDS on Silver:

“Skin Contact: No known effect on skin contact, rinse with water for a few minutes.
Serious Skin Contact: Not available.
Inhalation: Allow the victim to rest in a well ventilated area. Seek immediate medical attention.
Serious Inhalation:
Evacuate the victim to a safe area as soon as possible. Loosen tight clothing such as a collar, tie, belt or waistband. If breathing is difficult, administer oxygen. If the victim is not breathing, perform mouth-to-mouth resuscitation. Seek medical attention.

Ingestion:
Do not induce vomiting. Examine the lips and mouth to ascertain whether the tissues are damaged, a possible indication that the toxic material was ingested; the absence of such signs, however, is not conclusive. Loosen tight clothing such as a collar, tie, belt or waistband. If the victim is not breathing, perform mouth-to-mouth
resuscitation. Seek immediate medical attention.
Serious Ingestion: Not available.”

Source: ScienceLab.com
Link: http://www.sciencelab.com/xMSDS-Silver-9927253
Additional links about fuming: http://www.talkglass.com/forum/showt...1-Fuming-techs

Honeycombs
http://www.talkglass.com/forum/showt...fect+honeycomb

‘What I have been doing for my honeycombs is, I fume really heavy, then I blast it off with an aggressive oxy flame, then I bring it back with some soft reduction. Then rinse and repeat. I try to get a dark gasoline like color, I noticed if I fume too heavy and it gets all grey and cloudy it will stay that color, but when I blast off the grey haze and reduce it again I get the nice purple to blue fades when I flame strike. I didn’t get a pic of it, but one time I used the excess off of some cheap joints I got for my honeycomb and I got a really intense ruby red. I think it was china tube but I am not sure because the person I got them off of wasn’t sure if they were schott or china glass. all the other clear I use is simax”
Source: Heart Burn Glass http://www.talkglass.com/forum/showt...fect+honeycomb

“This is what I do.

1) Blow a reasonably thin bubble but not too thin (because you won't get the punty off without pulling a chunk out. c=====
2) Cut off the bubble and I open it right out to prevent fume getting on the outside. -----c
3) Fume the inside of the bubble heavily until it's shiny silver. Take care not to get fume on the outside.
4) Use oxidizing flame to remove fume until bubble is transparent again
5) Use reducing flame to 'grow' the fume back.
6) Close up your bubble using paddle & re-attach to tube making sure it is airtight
7) Heat entire bubble and blow out larger (1/2 as big again) until dangerously thin (estimate 0.5mm) C=====
8) Make honeycomb by applying dots. I heat the bubble until red hot where the dot is applied which facilitates a slight amount of 'mixing' of the fume(gives the haze) but care needs to be taken not to break right through and cause fume to come to the surface as it spoils the look of the comb. I get a 4mm rod molten on the end and apply it to the red soft spot on the bubble and then move the bubble out of the flame while keeping the 4mm rod in the flame rotate back n forth a little until it cuts off.
9) Condense with 1 slight puff out to round things out
10) Sometimes I lens it”

Source PyeR2: http://www.talkglass.com/forum/attac...0&d=1361824406

I never puff into mine once I start condensing.
Keep your elbow up at the right time and heating in the right spot to collapse.
Dot in center and punty up to dot previous to collapsing. Start on the outer rim and establish a centered collar to collapse the marble into.

“THINNER GLASS , so thin it will fold and sag fast in the direct flame. Keep the ball warm in the rear of the flame as you heat your clear rod for dots . Try not to touch the bubble with the flame when you are dotting up. Hit the bubble for a fast 1-2 count right where you add the dot .”

Source BoRo: http://www.talkglass.com/forum/showt...fect+honeycomb

Try a chunk of gold on one side of the fume rod and a tiny piece of silver on the other side of the same end, of the fuming rod. It can get tricky if you get both sides of the same end of the fume rod too hot. something might fall off or mix together.

‪Alfred M. Evans‬‬‬‬ ”You can fume with the flux or borax as well, get the end of a piece of 5mm glowing and get some of either melted on there and fume with it before your gold.”
Source: https://www.facebook.com/groups/453188471397229/

‪William Zorn‬‬‬‬ ”Pure gold cannot chemically bond to glass, it absolutely requires a flux. 22k, especially raw gold, will stick if worked very gently and if the glass is quite hot when it is applied. To bond pure gold, the best method is to either paint the piece to be fumed with white paste brazing flux and warm it in the kiln or alternatively hold it at the back of a bushy flame and sprinkle a little borax in the base of the flame. Either method creates a transparent boric oxide glaze on the surface that the gold can then be fumed onto. This way you get the color spectrum of pure gold without contaminating it with copper or silver.”
Source: https://www.facebook.com/groups/453188471397229/

‪Robert McAtee‬‬‬‬ “I've seen this done. As stated get the glass ripping hot. Dip it in the water, but don't put it deeper than the cap you are trying to strike, when working hollow for instance. Again, as stated a steam pocket will form around the glass, keeping it from cracking. The goal is to rapidly cool below 800 degrees to crystallize the silver. A very loud noticeable "pop" will occur above the sound of the steam bubbling up. That's when you know your done. Pull it out and continue to let it cool until all red color goes away. Then slowly heat it up in a nice soft flame. Try to angle it so you wrap the flame around the whole thing at once and heat it up to strike it out. If you pull it out to early(hehe) it won't work, if you leave it to long it will crack. Also don't do it more than once to a piece, typically to much stress.(I think this is all on here, I just put it all together”

Source: https://www.facebook.com/groups/4531...group_activity

‪William Zorn‬‬‬‬ “Oh and for anyone still wondering about green from gold, the usual method is light silver to get a yellowish hue, then fun gold on the glass relatively cold to produce a blue layer. The trick is not overheating the gold and turning it pink/purple.”

Source: https://www.facebook.com/groups/4531...group_activity

Even if I add too much silver to my mix, the silver burns off first or quicker than the gold leaving the gold behind. ,,,and then maybe I will add a tiny speck of silver to the gold to replenish what has vaporized.

Source Xiian: http://www.talkglass.com/forum/showt...silver%20alloy

**bowlpusher** · 08-05-2014, 08:23 PM

I hope this helps.

**PyroChixRock** · 08-05-2014, 08:33 PM

Well damn. You are awesome.

**paulsafo** · 08-05-2014, 08:46 PM

Hahahahahahahahahahahahaaaaaaaaaaaaa do you take applause, checks, money orders, cash, cigarettes or hand jobs? Seriously though... Hand jobs?

**bowlpusher** · 08-05-2014, 09:26 PM

I have more where that came from too. I've been lurking the forum for a long time and am putting together a class. I will post fragments of it as it comes along. Most of the stuff I have sourced is from the forum. Shit I might even get a sticky.... I do take rep points tho! Ball till you fall bro.

**paulsafo** · 08-05-2014, 09:32 PM

I'm on tapatalk I must find a computer. Uno momento.

**PyroChixRock** · 08-05-2014, 09:32 PM

Down for the stickie threads. Post new threads when you are aiming for that.

**Jason Lindquist** · 08-06-2014, 12:10 AM

Great compilation, bowlpusher. Thank you.

**Jimi The Don** · 08-06-2014, 06:19 AM

I have one thing to add. I think it was from Jason lee right at the beginning that said that the purest silver usually available is .999 but you can find .9999 wire though its expensive. I have to use it for dissolved oxygen electrodes because .999 or (three 9) will tarnish during the oxidation/annodizing process. Personally I use three 9 not four 9 for fuming, but I thought I'd point out that it can be readily found. But this has little to do with the info encapsulated so astoundingly by bowlpusher, so carry on.

**paulsafo** · 08-06-2014, 06:21 AM

you guys so great I feel so welcome.

**paulsafo** · 08-06-2014, 04:15 PM

This morning I subscribed to glassline and found some really cooooool info on this as well. You guys are great. Can't wait to practice. This answered my question in detail I never would have dreamed of. I have a better understanding of how striking works now too

time to apply some knowledge! I'll post pics as soon as I get back to my torch (I work as a musician by night after my bullshit office job) glass had to take a quick backseat while I use gig money to pay off my first couple months of not selling a whole lot while I'm learning.

Luckily I'm picking it up hella fast thanks to this forum and I'm working towards doing this and music full time and living MY dream. Thank you everyone for helping me get there. 25 and finally excited to work. Time to set some new goals.

**paulsafo** · 08-08-2014, 09:06 PM

Played a gig tonight. 2 hours of sweating my ass of and I used the money to buy this.

If anyone knows where to get some foil that isn't back ordered, let me know. Feels like I'm gonna waste a lot using drops, but there aren't a whole lot of options. Getting wire next time I can't find foil. I've heard leaf is difficult to work with.. Any thoughts?

**PyroChixRock** · 08-08-2014, 09:34 PM

Foil? Like gold leaf? Totally different application and outcome than fuming. Those little balls are good.

Smash them with a hammer if you want to be able to cut pieces off more precisely.

**dplaza** · 08-08-2014, 09:39 PM

i think you did good, leaf is more for wrapping the glass which i dont think can be done with boro. and wire is gonna cost more because they have to make it into wire. good luck i haven't tried gold yet, but i would just snip a tiny piece off and start small. also i would clean off the workbench so if it pops off its easy to find.

**paulsafo** · 08-09-2014, 07:58 AM

Good advice thank you. Glad this is what I ended up with then. Through a bit of digging someone suggested fuming. By melting clear then wrapping it around the tip and using that to fume, repeat as needed. Use foil it's thicker and kinda stay away from leaf it's too thin and hard to work with. Won't know til I try but I FINALLY get to be behind the torch for a little bit today.

**paulsafo** · 08-09-2014, 10:48 AM

I'm still not exactly sure how this happened. Afraid to look..

**PyroChixRock** · 08-09-2014, 11:00 AM

Aww sad face. Now I can't visit this thread anymore.

**Jimi The Don** · 08-09-2014, 11:25 AM

I bet that when you pull the towel away you'll be holding a bouquet of flowers.

**misled youth** · 08-09-2014, 12:02 PM

Tip, gold is about 45$ a gram right now. 42.09 today

Hammer those drops down nice and flat, cut into several more pieces.
That gram of gold should make tons of pipes once ya get the hang of it.

After putting a tiny piece on a rod and doing your fume. Set it down but do not let the hot end touch anything. "Use a rod rest of sorts" that will allow it to cool more evenly.
When getting ready to fume next piece heat the end of that rod super slowly to help reduce the risk of it popping off and either losing or doing the gold search squint.
Also if it sucks i to the glass rod and is encapsulated you have to much of a neutral or reducing flame. Adjust to a high oxy and heat on one side and it will come back to the surface.
"That tip may be backwards, have not had it happen for long long time"

Nice mystery wound!!!